Author Topic: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John  (Read 486509 times)

BaySailor

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1320 on: December 23, 2015, 06:17:08 PM »
thanks for that correction, hf.

jellybean

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1321 on: December 23, 2015, 07:13:19 PM »
Predictable, and understandable feelings and statement made by family members./jb


My heart goes out to the jury..

 I wish the press would stop repeating the Oland Family, and its Moosehead history, over and over, and over....... ......For heaven's sake, save print and air  space.
We get it -We got it quite awhile back...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/richard-olands-killer-still-at-large-family-members-warn-in-statement/article27933855/

« Last Edit: December 23, 2015, 08:31:42 PM by jellybean »

BaySailor

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1322 on: December 23, 2015, 08:21:29 PM »

 I am a bit tired of learning about that Brewery and it's history.
144 employees, does not make a major industry.

All across Canada, one will find many other family businesses who also have long histories and create more numbers in employment.  Oland's business is no different from others.
Yes, they are a major industry in Saint John, NB.  What does that say about employment opportunities in that city?  If one is to go by numbers - not much!!

No disrespect intended to the D. Oland and what he has achieved, and he can take pride in how well paid his employees are....obviously this business cares about their employees. And they should be highly commended for it. They have high standards, which is very rare imo.

I should mention a couple of decades ago Moosehead had some 400 employees and 2 breweries in the Maritimes, and were indeed a major business. The Oland wealth accumulated from the last century when it was a real going concern and quite successful. Since that heyday the removal of interprovincial trade barriers and the consolidation of breweries into 4 global players Moosehead has been forced to retrench significantly.       

jellybean

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1323 on: December 23, 2015, 08:48:20 PM »
I went back to my post and removed my comments that you have quoted BaySailor.
Yes, 400 employees would have been quite significant indeed, and thank you for your  clarification.  The press have never reported that - and have in a way done a disservice imo.
I can assume then, that this family is no longer a significant employer within N.B today?

We do not and cannot live in the past.  We sure would like to, when we recall the "better days".  I know, I would certainly like to....
My family (great uncles, and Grandfather) were in the  lumber business, and my family name well known..... for most of my life, and as all things change, so did the business which petered
out apparently.
They go back to the 1800's, and even prior, when they used horses on land with ropes tied to a sled while the men cut ice blocks out of the  Ottawa river to use for ice boxes (no fridges then) They built log booms, and hauled logs for both firewood and building.
Yet today there is a roadway named after us,  I had no part in it. Obviously,  neither my father, nor his children can take any credit for it. But the family name remains. And we never capitalized on our name, nor heritage.  We made our own way in this world.  That cannot be said for Dennis.

Time to let go.... things change in this modern world.... too darn fast, if you ask me.

jb 




 
« Last Edit: December 23, 2015, 09:22:11 PM by jellybean »

BaySailor

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1324 on: December 23, 2015, 09:19:51 PM »
Yes, the workforce is much smaller nowadays. In the more recent past they been a contract brewer for Guinness and such, brewing beer for others who sell regionally but do not have local production facilities. While the Irvings and McCains companies dwarf other businesses here, newer industries such as tech, and call centres, among others, have supplanted the brewing industry. Moosehead closed it's N.S. plant, as Olands Breweries did with it's Saint John plant, and both breweries have much smaller staffs now than they did in decades past. We have long struggled with our economy here in the Maritimes and such significant job losses have very painful. The Saint John Olands have always been keen to stay independent despite many overtures from the big brewers, and I think they have paid the price for that. If they had sold out there would be no head office jobs here and probably at best a small distribution and production facility owned by Guinness or Molsons, or perhaps nothing with beer products shipped in from large plants in Quebec and Ontario.           

I went back to my post and removed my comments that you have quoted BaySailor.
Yes, 400 employees would have been quite significant indeed, and thank you for your  clarification.  The press have never reported that - and have in a way done a disservice imo.
I can assume then, that this family is no longer a significant employer within N.B today?
jb

jellybean

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1325 on: December 23, 2015, 09:36:03 PM »
Many people from NB, NS and Nfd came out west to find work.... and with them.... they brought  Moosehead beer.  Never heard of it.  I am not a beer drinker, and have never tried one.
If I do have a beer, I like the Belgium ale, Stella Artois. I see it advertised today, but when I lived in Belgium as a young person, everyone drank it.

Most amazing that it is now imported.

Moosehead is considered to be a craft beer, according to beer snobs - and we have many new craft beer industries opening up.

However, Maritimers out west will always be loyal to Moosehead.  It is a small part of their home.
Every business is in a struggle today..... sad... and at our own country's peril.

jb
« Last Edit: December 23, 2015, 09:40:51 PM by jellybean »

Have faith

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1326 on: December 23, 2015, 11:54:05 PM »

I wanted to post this Globe and Mail obit, which is a tribute to Dick Oland's generous contribution to his community and the province of N.B.  It is easy to lose sight of his good deeds, which earned him an Order of Canada. 

We have all learned about Dick's dark side, and the emotional pain that he caused to those close to him. He certainly paid the ultimate price for his trangressions.  Regardless of his faults, and his dismal treatment of his family, he did not deserve a death sentence.  To put it into perspective, he was not a serial killer or pedophile or rapist who deserves no sympanthy.  Yet he suffered a violent death by murder, and nobody seems to care.

Dick deserves justice.   

RIP Dick. 

http://www.v1.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/Deaths.20110730.93271023/BDAStory/BDA/deaths

jellybean

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1327 on: December 24, 2015, 12:25:22 AM »
There was a correction made by the press who reported that received the Order of Canada, it was one step down from that (can't recall what it is called)  But you are right HF he did alot for his province, and deserved to be honored for it.

It was his own family, who tarnished his name..... we must remember that. We did not do it.

His horrible death, does get lost, in the saving of his son from 25 years of incarceration.

You are right in pointing that out, Have Faith.


How will Richard be remembered?  Will he be remembered for all of his good works - or as a penny pinching, abusive husband and father, who had a mistress,  of which his wife and children so readily reported ?

I hope the citizens of Saint John, will look at it with clear eyes, and remember him for the wonderful contribution that he made.
Obviously, he loved his city and his province.

With the press, and with Richard's family it is all about Dennis - nothing about Richard.

There has been not a word spoken by the family, of the horrible death that Richard endured.

About Richard's death?  Mother and wife - declare that there is a Killer on the loose.
There again.... it is all about Dennis.

My guess is that Richard's brutal chopping,excruciating painful,  murder will never see justice!!

After all, there is a killer on the loose.  Best to lock up your office.


Jb
« Last Edit: December 24, 2015, 01:15:43 PM by jellybean »

RubyRose

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1328 on: December 24, 2015, 04:50:45 AM »
I am very glad that the NB Department of Justice is offering professional support to any members of the jury who may wish to avail themselves of it.  This was a particularly gruesome crime and the long term effects on them will not disappear easily, if ever. 

The fact that it will continue to be in the news for a long time yet will not make it any easier.

RubyRose

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1329 on: December 24, 2015, 05:47:37 AM »
While I can certainly sympathize and understand why they are saying this, I find it interesting that the Oland family did not appear to be overly concerned about Richard's killer still being at large until Dennis was found guilty'

jobo

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1330 on: December 24, 2015, 07:03:19 AM »
Ruby rose...That also stands out to me.   If me or someone in my family was wrongfully charged (and convicted) I would be screaming loud and clear that they have the wrong guy and there is a killer running loose.
Not the case here.

RubyRose

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1331 on: December 24, 2015, 10:13:40 AM »
Also, jobo, they most certainly would have the available resources to fund an investigation on their own.  There, at least as far as we know, has never been any indication that they have shown an interest in doing this.

It seems as long as Dennis was not guilty, nothing else really mattered.  I think they depended too heavily on Dennis' lawyers getting him off and that is why this verdict was such a shock to them (Dennis and lawyers included).

blueriver

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1332 on: December 24, 2015, 10:44:32 AM »
I am sure Dennis' lawyers were paid huge dollars and will be paid more and, at least the way it came off to me through the tweets on this trial, they did not do an impressive job. Nothing to refute the cell tower ping other than to say perhaps Dick drove towards Rothesay at the same time Dennis did. Which is what he would have had to do. Dick Oland is the victim. A horrible death.

Maybe if Dennis manned up and told his mother and wife the truth, they wouldn't fret so much for him.

jellybean

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1333 on: December 24, 2015, 01:24:46 PM »
Nothing to refute the cell tower ping other than to say perhaps Dick drove towards Rothesay at the same time Dennis did. Which is what he would have had to do.

Yes, you got them on that one, blueriver. Perhaps Dick and Dennis waved as they passed each other.

Also, the ridiculous two possible reasons for the dna within blood stains on the jacket   Obviously the jury did not buy into it.

Now, we know why the defense did not want that jacket brought into trial.  Simply put -- it was damning, and the defense sputtered out lame excuses for it being there.
Perhaps they should of asked Dennis.

jb
« Last Edit: December 24, 2015, 01:29:53 PM by jellybean »

Have faith

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Re: Richard (Dick) Oland | Murdered | 69 | Saint John
« Reply #1334 on: December 26, 2015, 05:21:06 PM »
I seriously feel that murder cases should only be decided by a judge. 

Ordinary citizens should not have to suffer the fallout of significant missed wages, the psychological trauma of viewing graphic murder and autopsy photos, or the burden of deciding someone's fate in complex circumstantial evidence cases.

Unlike the USA, Canadian jurors are not allowed to discuss how they arrived at their decision of guilty or innocent. This is especially unfair in a "closed" court trial.  This leaves them open to possible negative public opinion (as in this case), or even with friends, with no right to defend their decision, based on the entire evidence presented to them (that the public missed) and their opportunity to see the witnesses and the accused first hand. 

In addition to all of this, they have to try and interpret the judge's instructions.  In this case, the instructions went over a few days, and compiled about a 240 page document.  This is a perfect example of a complex trial that should be decided by a judge.  It is an unfair burden for ordinary citizens who have been put under the gun of civic duty.  There is also a large cross section of jurors called to appear, who are granted leave from jury duty, and a list of those who are exempt from the get go:

""The lists [of exempt professions] keep growing over time, and you wonder whether or not you do get a representative sample of the population in terms of socioeconomic status, educational attainment and these kinds of things," said Stephen Penney, professor of criminal law at University of Alberta in Edmonton."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/jury-duty-unfair-burden-or-civic-obligation-1.994514
 
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/oland-jury-verdict-ptsd-baillie-1.3375019
« Last Edit: December 26, 2015, 05:29:51 PM by Have faith »