Unsolved Murders | Missing People Canada

Listing Of Unsolved Murders & Missing People In Canada => Ontario Unsolved Murders & Missing People => Toronto => Topic started by: AlbertaCowboy on April 04, 2007, 06:53:37 PM

Title: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: AlbertaCowboy on April 04, 2007, 06:53:37 PM
Nicole Louise Morin

(http://www.joneshakka.com/morin_nicole.jpg)

Missing since July 30, 1985
Toronto, Ontario
Classification: Non-Family Abduction



Vital Statistics

Date Of Birth: April 1, 1977
Age at Time of Disappearance: 8 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 4'0; 51 pounds
Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Brown hair; brown eyes.
Marks, Scars: Morin has a birthmark on the right side of her forehead and protruding ears. She has pierced ears.
Clothing: She was wearing a peach, one pieced bathing suit with colored stripes on the front, a green headband, red canvas shoes, and was carrying a peach colored blanket and a purple beach towel.
Dentals: Gap between her front teeth.



Circumstances of Disappearance

:
On July 30th, Nicole left her mother?s penthouse apartment in The West Mall, in Toronto's Etobicoke area, and vanished. There has been no trace of the 8 year old girl who was likely abducted moments after leaving the apartment in the Highway 427 and Rathburn Road area.

At 10:30am Nicole had gone to the lobby of the twenty story apartment building to pick up the mail. She returned to the apartment and got ready to go swimming with a playmate. Before leaving the apartment Nicole had spoken to a friend through the building's intercom and promised to be right down.

The playmate waited about 15 minutes before buzzing the apartment again to find out why Nicole hadn't arrived. The two girls had arranged to meet in the lobby and go to a supervised swimming pool at the rear of the building.
About 11:00am Nicole said goodbye to her mother and left the apartment. No one has seen the girl since she closed the apartment door and walked into the penthouse hallway.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on April 05, 2007, 02:35:10 AM
Was this the case where the wrong guy was busted and served time for?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: AlbertaCowboy on April 07, 2007, 03:26:18 PM
Was this the case where the wrong guy was busted and served time for?

the murder you are referring to was the Christine Jessop case.  Guy Paul Morin was convicted, and later acquitted of murdering her.  He was awarded $10 million for his wrongful conviction and incarceration.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on April 07, 2007, 11:49:05 PM
Didn't the prosecution sort of 'know' he was innocent but they withheld some information or something? I think that police\prosecutors who knowingly send an innocent person to jail should be sent to jail themselves.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: AlbertaCowboy on April 10, 2007, 01:37:13 PM
Didn't the prosecution sort of 'know' he was innocent but they withheld some information or something? I think that police\prosecutors who knowingly send an innocent person to jail should be sent to jail themselves.


No, they did not know he was innocent.  They were so convinced he was guilty that they withheld evidence from the defense attorneys.  You should read "Redrum the Innocent".  It wil probably be available at your local library, and is one of the best books written about wrongful convictions...
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on April 10, 2007, 02:14:32 PM
Thanks, I was going to the Library today anyway. I will see if they have that book, order it if they do not.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: crital on May 04, 2007, 11:43:32 AM
I knew Nicole Morin when I was younger she lived in Amherst NS for a few years!! She was my best friend. I can't believe her mom let her go to the pool alone!! She was barley never able to go alone in Amherst!! They had just moved from a very small town (Amherst) !! Something is weird!! The way the left Amherst was weird to!! I can't believe that she left the apartment 10 mins earlier than her friend called to ask where she was!!  Come on Mom it doesn't take 15 min to get to the bottom of the building!!
This is a weird case!! Bring in a physic and I bet we will be shocked!! I have Called RCMP  and they have never gotten back to me!!
I hope one day she is found!! I think of her ALL the time !! Miss you Nicole !
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on May 04, 2007, 11:40:24 PM
Hi Crital, thanks for writing. I am very sorry about your friend. I guess she has not been found. Is there a site with the details of this case? It does seem odd that a mother would let a 7 year old girl walk around the city alone like that. Was mother the last to see her?

WHen you say that you called the RCMP and they never called back, is that because you have some info to offer them? I think the Toronto Police would be in charge of this as Etobiko is now part of Toronto.

I'll see what I can find about this case, if we could get more info that would be great. Thanks Crital.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Bucke Bleichert on October 25, 2007, 11:41:57 PM
To be fair to Nicole's mother, she was operating a daycare from her apartment and had several children to take care of including a couple of babies....She could not even go to look for her daughter herself until all the children had been picked up....Nicole's father was on a delivery run to Peterborough for a dry cleaner.

Thanks for letting me jump in with my 2 cents worth. I'm getting all my details from Toronto Star Archives which goes back to 1885, the year of the abduction....

Interesting forgotten developments in the case:
Confession by Lovie "Interstate Man" Riddle who was arrested in Maine for assaulting a woman--interesting because Nicole's apartment is by the 427.....And how many people falsly confess to child abduction? Police ruled him out for conflicting statements....

A note written by Nicole in school saying she was "going to disappear". Police said it was a child's imagination.

Art Nicole's theory that someone from his church took his daughter because of the court battles with his wife over money and that his daughter went along with it....Right now, I think this theory holds the key to Nicole's fate....which is why I'm trying to find the details of this theory....
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on October 26, 2007, 04:45:19 AM
Very interesting, thanks for the input. It is true that lots of weirdos do confess to these things. That is one reason police probably hold back some evidence. It would not suprise me at all if the police have a really good suspect but are short on proof. I hope this case gets solved one day, it would be very nice.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Bucke Bleichert on October 26, 2007, 12:18:23 PM
It would not suprise me at all if the police have a really good suspect but are short on proof.
The burden of proof is too great nowadays, you're right. And there's too much dependence on DNA....
Police claimed to have narrowed the suspect list to one or two people and were supposedly a couple of weeks away from solving the case. A suspect may have worked near the airport and the police, "following a lead", searched the ravine on the west side of Pearson International only 3 miles from Nicole's apartment. They found a black jacket and black pants in a bag and a newspaper dated the day after the disappearance with Nicole on the cover....

Art Morin acted on a tip from psychic Alfred Ward and had a party search a wooded area of East Oakville without finding anything.

I'm interested in the report of a slender blond woman dressed in white with a notebook standing at the end of the hall on Nicole's floor, 40 minutes prior to the disappearance. She never turned up in the investigation....Why would a stranger be on the 20th floor penthouse with a notebook at 10:30 in the morning?

Youtube has a re-enactment of the disappearance. It mentions that some witnesses say Nicole did make it down the elevator. They claim she was seen in the lobby and outside. Obviously in that case, she took her time coming down, more than half an hour even, and maybe had no intention of keeping her rendezvous with her friend to go swimming. That's one of the reasons I'm interested in Art's theory that someone took her to harbour her from family troubles....But maybe I'm biased in favour of a happier outcome....

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on October 26, 2007, 01:22:08 PM
Here is the clip.

[youtube=425,350]2HievAQhXhw[/youtube]
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Bucke Bleichert on October 27, 2007, 03:39:47 PM
Thanks for posting the re-enactment. Too bad they don't have the whole show. Maybe GTA's Most Wanted will repeat it. (The actor looked about 4 years older and a foot taller though.)

I don't think they mentioned that Nicole went down to pick up mail at 10:30 or so. That was the same time the suspicious woman with the notebook was seen at the end of the hall on her floor. The witness came forward with this information when residents were re-interviewed:

The woman was white, about 35 years old, 5 foot, 5-7 inches tall, slender, very fair, dark blond, shoulder-length hair parted on the left,
She was wearing a white skirt with black pattern, a white or cream-colored, short-sleeved blouse open at the neck and white or cream colored high-heeled shoes....
She wasn't Karla Homolka because she didn't meet Paul Bernardo until 1987, two years later....

Nicole's father hired a PI and traveled to the US with him. He obviously wasn't chasing a pedophile. He was tracking either relatives or friends or people from his church. He had an "insider" theory, irregular as it seems.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on October 27, 2007, 06:54:35 PM
INteresting. If a woman was involved, I wonder what the motive is and if it is possible Nicole is still alive?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Bucke Bleichert on October 28, 2007, 11:14:24 PM
Holding a notebook will, of course, give someone an excuse to keep their head down and not show their face. Although police did circulate a composite of the woman....
With 20 floors, it's 20:1, she'd be standing there at the right time....And highly suspicious that she didn't come forward in a highly publicized newstory....

By coincidence ??? or intuition, I happened to have rented Dark Waters last week. Anyone seen it? The ghost of a girl that disappeared haunts an apartment. A lot of the action happens on an elevator....

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on October 29, 2007, 12:23:01 AM
I have not seen that film yet, I'm sure I'll get around to it.

This case seems like there is someone out there who holds the clue and can solve it. I watch those cold case shows on A and E and this case has the feel of some of those ones that end with someone finally giving the cops the right info.

I know it is unlikely, but I hope it has a happy ending.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Tony Righy on January 03, 2008, 01:44:13 PM
It's nice to be optimistic about Nicole being found alive. This Harboured By "Friends" From Art's Church Theory does give us hope. But I believe after searching in Canada and the US, Art stated that all his leads turned up empty. If the theory had merit, why couldn't he bring her home? Was it fantasy, wishful thinking, hoping against hope?
Maybe he was just grasping at straws, trying to stay optimistic about bringing his daughter home, and not being able to bring himself to think the worst.

I don't think they mentioned that Nicole went down to pick up mail at 10:30 or so. That was the same time the suspicious woman with the notebook was seen at the end of the hall on her floor. The witness came forward with this information when residents were re-interviewed....

 :-\ ???Here we have a witness from her floor admitting to being in the hall at the same time Nicole went to get mail and 40 minutes before she disappeared. Was it a man? If it was I'd be suspicious because the woman he witnessed was never identified. Not only that--Why didn't he (?) remember the blond woman until 4 weeks later and why did he only relate the story when the cops returned for information, all the while the cops were all over the apartment, searching it 4 times and had a command post in the lobby for days? Shy person who didn't want to get involved or a criminal who likes to insert himself into the investigation.
The top theory was someone from her apartment did it, probably someone from her floor if she never made it on the elevator. Maybe someone was stewing over the hot long weekend and saw Nicole wandering the halls in her bathing suit. He may never have planned to kill her.
After 8 months, the police had it narrowed down to one or two suspects (I don't think it was the parents), one who worked "near the airport", south-east corner less than a mile from the apartment, and were confident of a quick resolution. (The last time they were that confident was 7 months before when someone found a green headband in Bradford which Nicole's mother said wasn't her daughter's.)
They expected to find the body dumped somewhere nearby where they hadn't already looked. They tried the ravine next to the airport (where Air France went down) and all they found was a bag with black clothes and a newspaper dated the day after the disappearance with Nicole on the cover, which yielded no clues.
No body was found and the massive search was called-off a month later.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 12:17:52 AM
yes, it would be nice to think Nicole could be still alive.  I have been looking into the casey bohun case in bc and I have come across something interesting.  Nicole and casey's names are posted here. www.droitfondamental.eu/07-ZandvoortBase.htm    There are quite a few pages to be read, and not for the faint of heart.  I haven't gone thru all yet,  it suggests they have been trafficked (sp) into prostitution.  some articles are translated some not.  Check it out
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: kindheart on January 10, 2008, 10:46:30 AM
I too would like to see this list you refer to solvy-if you could. Thanks..

Des, here is the altavista translation;


"The Children of Satan In 1998, Marco Dimitri of Bologna, founder of the "Children of Satan" were shown, inter alia, to have locked up a child in a coffin containing the corpse of a woman. Dimitri was then discharged but nobody denied the physical violence exerted on the child locked up in the coffin. Each satanic sect practises rites which envisage the use of the children but all this is skilfully hidden. The undergone traumatism will be recorded mentally by the minor who, victim of other consecutive traumatisms to undergone violences, will entrust to therapeutists. Those will note what they note but will not be able to bring the least proof on the causes of the noted psychological damage. The ritual abuse, the satanic ritual or with satanic tendency, the p?do criminality disguised in ritual in common have the violence of all types on the animals, the human beings particularly the young people, the children, the women, the use of substances hallucinogens, narcotics, hypnotizing, human blood or animals. (see: Long Anton in "the Order of the nine Angels" which prevails everywhere in Europe, and Alister Crowley in its "Legis Liber")"
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 11:53:34 AM
Hi Des & kindheart.  Sorry I am not good at this computer thing. I tried to copy & paste but it does not seem to reprint the entire page, may have something to do with it being translated in several languages.  so I just typed www into this reply message. Today I tried again to copy and paste but still can'tget it right.  I will try to find the couple of references to  casey and nicole again.  When you go to this site , go to the top and select zandvoort, then scroll down to see  a lot of boxes forming a graph, their names are there, but I will find the specific article which mentions them
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 12:06:15 PM
Nobody would have been identified in ten years and there would be no Belgian dossiers in the Zandvoort file, according to Prosecutor TAC, who did not explain how it is possible to identify the nationality of an unidentified person. But he quoted a sentence from the official report that ends with the biometric identification of several Zandvoort children: Katrien De Cuyper, murdered in Antwerp and who is of Belgian nationality; Cecile Bloch, murdered in Paris; Casey Bohun and Louise Morin, missing from Canada; and Magdalena Gruzaska missing from Poland. The official report has been followed by a constitution of injured person, which by Belgian law, prevents that the file be destroyed before the complaint is treated.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 12:22:53 PM
it doesn't say they have evidence of murder, but what I found interesting was, they seem to use pics of some of the children with overlays to identify them.
see the heading  ID service from the top of the main page.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 01:59:57 PM
Yes, the more you read the worse it gets.  apparently this site tries to tell the story of how the many different pedo groups were broken up, but because of rich, high ranking govt people involved, the real perps were never taken to trial. its quite disgusting. It apears that Belgium and Holland govts are the worst.Also Spain and Italy. And they are still in operation.  In addition since the fall of the Soviet Union, that area is being overun with new groups and extensions of ones already operating in almost all other parts of the world.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Adrian on January 10, 2008, 03:18:48 PM



Those stats are alarming! 35 children, being abducted by pedophiles, or trafficers, is way too many. 35 too many!

I wonder how many are killed, in other Countries, as well as Canada.These guys, latch onto each other, communicate, probably have parties, and so sick and twisted. These guys or gals, should be declared dangerous offender for life. They should stay in jail for life. >:( >:( >:(
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 03:51:43 PM
Yes, its really a shame on humanity.. If Can. can lose 35 kids  to stranger abduction a year, think about countries that don't even bother to look for their missing kids stats!  does anyone know if Can. has a database for unidentified remains or missing children that can be accessed by the public?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: CraftyGal on January 10, 2008, 05:46:15 PM
I am not sure.  I believe the missing children are listed on the National Centre for Missing and Exploited Children at http://www.missingkids.com/ (http://www.missingkids.com/) as for the remains, we are trying to establish a national DNA Bank to store the DNA of unidentified remains. 

Correct me if I am wrong, I believe this was a campaign started by a family that believes that the Jane Doe found on the Pickton farm is their missing daughter and they have been unable to confirm this.

Crafty
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 06:54:13 PM
Hi Crafty.  Thanks for the info, I just read up about it.  An interesting stat there was that in 2002 there were 100 unidentified remains in bc morgues! 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 10, 2008, 07:04:20 PM
No one should have to rely on luck to find their loved one, but right now the lack of federal leadership on creating a national DNA bank and a national missing persons leaves an inadequate, patchwork process in place.? Mr. Marston added: ?Right now in Canada, if human remains are found there is no simple way to compare that DNA to the DNA of missing persons right across this country. The families and friends of missing persons are asking this Government to make that possible.?

Mr. Marston is an NDP leader in eastern Canada.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: CraftyGal on January 10, 2008, 07:21:37 PM
Hi Crafty.  Thanks for the info, I just read up about it.  An interesting stat there was that in 2002 there were 100 unidentified remains in bc morgues! 

That is so sad... :'(

Crafty
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on January 10, 2008, 11:27:08 PM
Gee whiz, 100 remains? Well, there are now 2 known serial killers behind bars, probably at least 2 more.

Good point about national leadership on DNA stuff. For years Harper and crew were promising all these measures and so far they have not really done anything. 2 years this month, that more is more then enough time to enact tougher sentences and equiping police with more tools. $20 says that will be an issue they promise next election.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 26, 2008, 04:30:34 PM
There is new info posted on this site about Nicole.. Its a very long read and a part of it has to be translated from french.

www.droitfondamental.eu/07-Nicole-Louise_Morin-FR.html
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: kindheart on January 26, 2008, 05:00:00 PM
Maybe you should forward that to police right now solvy-especially if you think they may know some real information about little Nicole?

If you need a translator, try this.
babelfish.altavista.com

I came back to make sure you have the email contact for the unit looking after Nicole's case;

homicide@torontopolice.on.ca

Also to share this map that highlights ongoing operations related to child exploitation in Canada and European countries, they are cooperating like never before;
(http://ncecc.ca/images/koala.jpg)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on January 27, 2008, 12:40:25 AM
kindheart,  I have just emailed using the addy you provided, thankyou.  Even though the article says that the info was sent to the RCMP in 2005, I was thinking that maybe not all groups share their info ( what a shame).  I will let you know if I get a reply.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: kindheart on January 27, 2008, 01:09:26 AM
Thats great.
Thanks.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on February 17, 2008, 09:26:32 PM
A person sent me an e-mail saying that the Zanvoort photos are not a match.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on February 17, 2008, 11:57:30 PM
Dear Chris,
Just to clarify: On Tuesday, February 13, Nicole's father saw the pictures linked on Ellee Seymour's site (I believe the links were originally posted on this site). There is a side shot and one from the front. I was on the phone with him when he first looked at them and he did not recognize his daughter. What you can take from that I don't know. I myself wouldn't rely only on a father's memory or my own impression. What do you think?
Droitfondamental declares the Zanvoort photos to be a 100% match with Nicole based on the MIT biometric's program. No track record for the program is given however. More input is necessary, I think.
In closing, let me just thank you for finding this information and helping to bring this to Art's attention. I understand these pictures have been available for a while. I assure you Art had never seen them before.
Art is in regular contact with a police officer and promises to take these pictures to her. He sounded very hopeful that, with everyone's help, we'll find out the truth--we hope, bring back Nicole.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on February 18, 2008, 12:42:14 AM
Thanks Takmet,

It is possible I guess over time memory can hold a different picutre, but it sure would be nice if they can be put to the test to see if this is a match.

Everyone here who put this site together does this for one reason and that is to help and make people aware. I really hope that one day someone who may know something will find this site and choose to contact the police with whatever they know.

Thanks for stopping by, I hope this case is solved soon.

Chris
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on February 18, 2008, 06:28:34 PM
:-\ ???Here we have a witness from her floor admitting to being in the hall at the same time Nicole went to get mail and 40 minutes before she disappeared. Was it a man? If it was I'd be suspicious because the woman he witnessed was never identified.
It was a woman. She lived in an apartment near the elevator.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on February 18, 2008, 09:20:20 PM
Des, you are right to be cautious about anything on the internet.  I am trying to find out more , but some of the translated wording is really hard to figure out. 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on February 18, 2008, 09:26:04 PM
Takmet, Hi and welcome.  I cannot imagine how hard it was to bring this forward to mr. Morin.  Although it may be a step forward, it only brings more questions and few answers.  If it turns out not to be nicole, so be it, but if it is, then the rcmp have had this info since 2005 and still have not located her.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on February 19, 2008, 12:31:41 AM
Des,  Yes, I did read that part, before the  "adult content " warning was there.  It was so disgusting that I had to shut down and think about it for a while. I reallly don't think it addds anything to the site except shock value. Even if I knew this info, I wouldn't put it out on the internet.  The only thing I could come up with is that the site appears to come from France or Belgium, and they have pretty liberal ideas over there. I have been trying to translate some of the pages.  There does seem to be alot of info relating to the larger picture of child porn rings.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on February 19, 2008, 02:32:58 PM
des, when I first found the site, I was researching the Dunahee and Bohun cases, and I think I found it on someones blog.  I went in blind as the blogger didn't say it was very discriptive. I came here to read all I could on the 2 cases, and saw that this site had not been seen by the forum.  I spent weeks thinking about putting this site forward here. I just couldn't let go of the fact that if Nicole or casey were my kids, i would have to know this information, sick as it is. It must take every ounce of energy to put one foot in front of the other for these parents of missing kids.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on February 19, 2008, 09:11:37 PM
Yeah putting a link to something like that could be a bad idea. I have entered many pedophile liberation forums (they are not in violation of the law at all) and I would not even link to any of those.

Belgiam and France are definetly countries that do not frown upon adults having sexual relationships with kids unless they are really young. In Canada, Montreal is sort of like that, pedophiles often speak of Montreals liberal views on this issue, and it was no coincidence that Americas Most Wanted recently busted an american pedophile living there.

Actually, I do not even think it is a 'Liberal' point of view. Rather, I think it is a lack of understanding of the issue. Much like back in the 70's drinking and driving was normal, and now it is not. Liberal implies people think this is good, normal, accpetable. I don't think people felt that way about Drinking and driving either.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on February 19, 2008, 11:45:52 PM
 des, no offense taken, I am new here and new to posting on forums, so maybe sometimes my choice of wording doesn't always  convey my exact thoughts.
 I had not really thought about peds being able to read this forum, but of course it could happen. i agree that the site would be very controversial and maybe lead conversations into areas that this forum does not want to go.  Even though we know things like this happen, do we really need to see it in PRINT.

 I also agree that we should not link to it.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on February 20, 2008, 01:39:01 AM
LOL, Solvy that is so true. When writing, we miss the body language, tone of voice and word things differently then actually speaking. I often get misunderstood as I am not that good at writing, but I am very good at hand gestures and facial expressions!

I am very certain that murderers and other weirdos read this site. We learned the BTK killer used some forums related to the subject, and I know from reading the pedo forums that they do go off and post on sites like this to do some PR and stuff.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on February 20, 2008, 11:52:27 AM
Chris

I see what you mean, the expression on your cat icon wonderful, where did you find him?  :)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on February 20, 2008, 01:16:09 PM
The European site did not claim Nicole ended up in Europe but only that her picture was sold to someone there. No Canadians have positively been identified. I'm sure out of all those pictures, you're bound to find one that looks like one of our missing children.
The spokesperson even believes the pictures were taken the same day as the abduction eventhough it looks to me like at least a 2 year age gap in those pictures and the missing person picture.
I find it hard to believe that Nicole could be so unlucky as to run into a potential or real predator in the short time she was exposed in the hall and/or on the elevator. Mostly I'd say in front of the elevator.
Danger from outside I could understand where someone could just stand there and look around or have a smoke and wait for someone to pass. Inside an apartment? History channel episodes on Kayla Kladusz and Andrea Atkinson show them both lured from outside.
And if this case is similar, Nicole not only ran into a predator, perhaps seconds or a couple of minutes after she left her apartment, but one who knew how to hide a body. This is the most densely populated area of Canada. Bodies almost always turn up eventually. Why didn't Nicole's? This is a big clue, I think, not something that should stall the investigation.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on February 20, 2008, 07:31:28 PM
I admire Ms. de Croy for her work and appreciate the honesty of her website. Her foundation has 90,000 cases to cover and she took time out for the Nicole case and helped jumpstart it at least. She's certain she's a Zanvoort victim although her certainty is based on a computer analysis.
Have you seen the picture of the Zanvoort "Nicole" from the front? It's on Ellee Seymour's site. Do you think it's 100% her, like they do, or do they put too much stock in biometric analysis?

 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on February 21, 2008, 11:25:08 AM
The ring was uncovered by an anti-pornography "vigilanti" group. Maybe that's why Canadian authorities had no interest. (Although there were Americans on the list of who got the pictures, there were no Canadians, unless they consider us "Americans" like some Europeans do.) One person, a "senior member" got the death sentence, based on information provided by an independant crimefighting organization accused of breaking into an apartment to get it!! Would Canada consider that? Obviously not.
I have no problems with the site. As long as the pages have proper descriptions and warnings of content, they can put up anything they want on their site. Remember, this story gots back to 1998 at least. It took 10 years for us and a Canadian parent with a missing child to see the pictures from the time the CD Rom was found.
The Foundation isn't initiating all the publicity. Two Canadians were the ones who first looked at the pictures and thought they saw Nicole and Casey.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on February 22, 2008, 12:52:17 AM
Quote
Two Canadians were the ones who first looked at the pictures and thought they saw Nicole and Casey.

That is interesting. I hope this means now that the police are going to take a long hard look at this. I know there were many Canadians who have been trying to expose the pedo undergroud for a long time, no one listened, now they are. It does exsist.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: never_lose_hope on March 04, 2008, 03:06:04 PM
I've read a ton of stuff on this case and wish there were active TV shows which still present the cases of these missing people especially the kids, there needs to be closure! Someone somewhere has to have seen something, seen her and have felt something was wrong, if they give the case publicity again perhaps it will trigger a memory of someone and finally police could crack the case.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on March 05, 2008, 01:42:56 AM
I've read a ton of stuff on this case and wish there were active TV shows which still present the cases of these missing people especially the kids, there needs to be closure! Someone somewhere has to have seen something, seen her and have felt something was wrong, if they give the case publicity again perhaps it will trigger a memory of someone and finally police could crack the case.

It could be that the police feel it was domestic and may even have some proof that it was. Many missing child cases get lots of publicity, sadly, some do not.

After all your research, do you think it is possible a person known to girl in a position of authority did something to her? I don't think a stranger took her, it does not seem to be a crime of opportunity.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: never_lose_hope on March 05, 2008, 09:51:49 AM
Yes I do, I've read theories from people saying they believe a church group who knew her may have taken her away from the stress she was apparently facing at home, or another known authority figure. I do feel it is very probable that someone known to her took her away from her home situation, but it would be so amazing to know now that she is alive and well living a normal life.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on March 05, 2008, 11:50:44 PM
but it would be so amazing to know now that she is alive and well living a normal life.

Indeed that would! I would hope that is the case, if there was some involvement in a strange church who knows.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on March 12, 2008, 05:24:35 PM
How sad is that when your best hope is that the child was kidnapped by a "cult"? I wish we could have an Elizabeth Smart resolution but Art Morin flatly denied any involvement of the church when I asked him about it. I'm sure the church was small and he could cover all the bases, as I assume he did when he traveled with an investigator. Maybe I'll ask him for more details.
I personally was a big Herbert W. Armstrong man in the 1980s, watched his show and subscribed to his literature, only didn't attend local services because the church replied to my letter, requesting information on its location, with dress code recommendations.
One curious thing is that Armstrong died in January of 1986, about six months after the disappearance. I mention this because the church underwent a split upon the death of the founder and Art mentioned it. Could Nicole have been lost there in the shuffle?
I'll admit it was an end-times church. Whether it turns people into end-timers or just attracts them, you can decide. End-timers will of course have nothing to lose.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on March 12, 2008, 11:59:00 PM
Well some end timers are so convinced, they'll do whatever it required. People have sold all there stuff, commited suicide, gave everthing they own etc.

If he went to a church like that.....
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on March 16, 2008, 12:11:32 AM
I've sent an e-mail to the former Toronto WCG Pastor, Neil Earle. He can tell us how big the church was and maybe what he remembers about Art Morin and his missing daughter and any possible contact between her and members, with and/or without Art.
Summer of 1985 was one of conflict between shoppers and stores that had the newstands of the Plain Truth magazine. An IGA in Etobicoke had to pull the newstand and the Etobicoke guardian published one of Earle's letters regarding the accusation of recruitment. I still remember some of that.
Here's hoping they "recruited" Nicole. Some of those WCG leaders and members would have large properties so could easily hide a girl.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on March 16, 2008, 12:58:25 AM
It has happened hasn't it? So it could be very very possible.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Takmet on March 17, 2008, 12:22:05 PM
I've sent an e-mail to the former Toronto WCG Pastor, Neil Earle. He can tell us how big the church was and maybe what he remembers about Art Morin....
The church had 500 members. Thank you, Pastor Earle.

That's a pretty big church.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on April 28, 2008, 04:39:41 AM
Very good idea to have made a facebook group. I feel this mystery will be solved at one point. It would not surprise me now, if the police have a clearer picture of who did it.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: capeheart on July 14, 2008, 07:16:07 PM
Nicole just disappeared off the face of the earth, this is so unbelievable that no one saw anything, especially if they believe she got to the main floor. It is possible that she was taken before she even got on the elevator and taken into an apartment.  Someone might have been watching her movements and knew she lived there and was quite aware of her going to swim in the pool and meeting her friend in the lobby. I believe whatever happened to her was right in that building and it would be very easy to hide a crime, to get rid of a body, so very easy. They could be moving out and had movers come and take items out of the building, they would never be found out.  I just watched a show on 48 Hours where a young woman who had been with her boyfriend on a trip came back to her condo, where there were 480 units and a lot were unoccupied. She expressed to friends that she was afraid of some painters that were watching her and doing maintenance to the building. She disappeared without a trace. Her things were there from the trip she was on. Her boyfriend lived two and a half hours away and of course, he was the first suspect, but he was at his place of work. She disappeared at around 7:00 a.m. when she was on her way to work and nobody saw a thing. They do have a video of a person getting out of her car in a parking lot, but there is a fence in the way of identifying the individual. So tragic that her mother did not immediately go looking for Nicole when her friend called after 15 minutes and said she did not show up. Anything could have happened, but I do not think that she is alive. I believe a horrible crime was committed in the building right where she lived and someone got away with murder. A list of everyone that lived on that floor and in that building should have been provided, 100% sure there were sex offenders living there. Sure hope somebody it will be solved. Prayers and love to her family, they will never get over it. :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on July 15, 2008, 12:34:13 AM
Quote
100% sure there were sex offenders living there

Good point. Those freaks are experts at puring kids. That is how you get a child away without a trace. If it was a pedo, it was probably carefully planned.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: debbiec on July 15, 2008, 03:15:06 PM
Young kids are so vulnerable too because they are so trusting. I think young kids tend to believe that they know someone even if they have only seen them occasionally. In the case of Nicole she may have even just seen this person around the building enough times that she felt she "knew" them. To me it makes the most sense that she was abducted by someone from the building. It could have also been an  employee from the building seeing as they have master keys for not only the apartments, but also other areas where you could hide someone untill it was convenient to move them somewhere else. I thought that if it was someone that came in from outside they would have probably taken the friend instead as she was downstairs alone. In most buildings with intercoms you have to have the person "buzz" you in before you can enter the lobby so I'm wondering if anyone else could have heard her on the intercom and intercepted the elevator on another floor.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on July 16, 2008, 12:33:26 AM
Yeah, that is a good point, the buzzer. I guess she probably never left the building. There was a case like that in Toronto, a tenant took a girl to the basement and killed her. Sick people. Not sure why, but it seems Toronto and area has an abnormally high number of pedophiles who kill little girls.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Shwa on July 16, 2008, 08:55:37 AM
"but it seems Toronto and area has an abnormally high number of pedophiles who kill little girls."

A matter of numbers and the deviance factor in those numbers.  Toronto will always have larger occurances of deviance due to the larger population.  I mean, almost one third of the Canadian population lives in the GTA/Golden Horseshoe of Ontario and Toronto proper is, I beleive, either the 4th or 5th largest city in North America.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on July 16, 2008, 02:41:21 PM
Yes TOronto has a huge population, Houston Texas is even bigger then Toronto and yet it does not come close to the number of pedo murders of kids. Including all the solved cases, there seems to be so many.

Mind you, Houston did have a child serial killer in the early 70's, a gay one who targeted teenage boys.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Shwa on July 17, 2008, 07:42:26 AM
Hey Chris, how did you find out that Houston has fewer pedophile murders than Toronto?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on July 17, 2008, 05:20:04 PM
I was raised in Houston. Plus I have a Houston version of this site. There does not seem to be even close to as many as Toronto. Florida seems bad too, they have a lot.

Toronto and San Fran were to by knowledge, the only places that ever had red light districts for children back in the 60's and 70's. Maybe that is why, Toronto could have just attracted pedos then.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Tony on October 02, 2008, 08:37:17 AM
I can't garner from the article where the orphanage Haut de la Garenne was though.
Thanks for the update, Desespere. Haut de la Garenne is on Jersey Island in the English Channel.

I spent a couple of hours looking at old newspaper reports in the library but found little new information:
Art Morin passed a lie detector.
He's not related to Guy Paul Morin.
One of the first places Art looked was at Ontario Place where he had taken Nicole the weekend before because she liked it so much and he thought she might have gone back there.

I didn't try to look up an article on the murder of Art Morin's sister by her husband in Iroquois Falls because I only have the year--1961. The husband was a suspect in Nicole's disappearance but was ruled out. He was living in Quebec at the time and was dead by the time newspapers reported he was suspect.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Tekmat on October 18, 2008, 07:06:32 PM
It could be that the police feel it was domestic and may even have some proof that it was.
Do you mean I might have actually spoken to the killer?
I'm asking because I make it a point never to correspond or converse with murderers so as not to make my family afraid. Not that I will be in the future even if he did it; Art Morin is only talking to police about the case now anyway. His Ontario Place theory seems pretty far-fetched, like the Church did it one, or his wife's ex who lives in California did it. Ontario Place has to be at least 6 miles away.

I hear Robert Hoshowsky is interested in writing about about Nicole and Sharin Morningstar. Maybe he can get some information out of the police.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Websher Lock on October 19, 2008, 11:48:43 AM
Do you mean I might have actually spoken to the killer?
Duh?!!!
Motive, opportunity, French guy from North Bay.  :P
I've read John Walsh's book on Adam Walsh and Art doesn't display any of the behaviors of someone who lost a child to a stranger. One wacky theory after another for years doesn't add up to anything but diversion.
If I was the moderator (good thing I'm not) I'd put some of these cases in the solved pile without an actual conviction?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Adrian on October 24, 2008, 04:51:38 PM

Websher Lock::
If I was the moderator (good thing I'm not) I'd put some of these cases in the solved pile without an actual conviction?
Ouch!!!!*********************************
Listen up Sherlocke, people who write in their comments, oppinions, ideas, theories, are what keeps these cases that are Unsolved going. We may not agree but, give us a break, will ya?
Takmet, Tekmat, will ya quit playing with who you are?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Tekmat on October 26, 2008, 06:00:05 PM
Do you mean I might have actually spoken to the killer?
Duh?!!!
Duh yourself!
I was only hoping that Nicole was taken by Art's (and my unofficial) former church and was alive and safe. Or that she was taken by the Zanvoort ring and still alive. Yesterday's optimism.

Tekmat
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on October 27, 2008, 11:51:39 AM
I would love to believe Nicole is alive and well and living in middle suburbia. There's just one problem with that thinking. This is the age of the computer. Nicole would be 31 years old now. Even if she didn't remember her original name, I'm sure she would recognize her picture from when she was little. She's on all the missing sites porchlight, doe, ours, missing children of Canada etc. etc. She would have come forward by now, I would think.
I've always maintained the same man took her as took Christine Jessop 16 months earlier. We were lucky to find Christine. We haven't been lucky finding Nicole. :'( :'( :'(
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Kayley on December 31, 2008, 12:08:37 PM
Im alittle ashamed of people, this little girls parents are not to blame ... in all honesty think about this ,her friend is down stairs waiting to go swimming she had just gone up stairs from the mail box probably already in her bathing suit expecting her friend would be there and they would just go... now someone in that building obvilouly saw her and waited when she came out again and took her... why didnt the police start checking back grounds and interviewing the people in that bulilding... it was someone in that building but not her parents someone needs to go back over the tenets that lived in that build the date of July 30, If she was down stairs then goes up stairs her friend calls and she goes back down the stairs/elevator she is still in that building if she never exited it!!! what was so hard in that thinking process? A little girl was missing they should have done everything they could to find her...
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on December 31, 2008, 12:33:26 PM
Yes Kayley and if the friend watched the elevator, come down go back up and then come down again empty, there's a good bet she never left the top two floors unless of course the kidnapper used the stairs and slipped out the back way. The police weren't as thorough as they could have been and I think it was probably because they suspected Art or Louise. Even suspecting them though, they should have investigated other possibilities such as a  possible link to the kidnap/murder of nine year old Christine Jessop.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Kayley on December 31, 2008, 01:02:34 PM
I'm not entitled to say anything,but they had a lead about 4-5 years ago, they even put Nicole back in the papers. In the interrogation they messed up (for lack of better explanation)and he is the same man suspected of killing Christine Jessop!
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on December 31, 2008, 01:15:37 PM
Read back in the thread. I always suspected that and way back when Nicole went missing before the Redrum book came out on Christine I told Art the two were connected. I even wrote the police department about the vehicle, license plate, where he worked. It always made me sad that I couldn't get them to listen.
The suspect's name wouldn't be Jeff by any chance would it?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Kayley on December 31, 2008, 01:21:00 PM
no. All i can say is his mother lived in the same building at the time and he was there and this was not his first nor his last.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on December 31, 2008, 02:23:48 PM
That's ok, there's still a Jeff involved. Could be a friend, he had to have help with Nicole to smuggle her out of the building. That place was crawling with police in the days after she went missing or so I read in the papers.  Maybe not so much with Christine as she wasn't in a penthouse apartment.
Funny, I went to write Jeff and just noticed I had written Jess.
I knew it wasn't his first. I don't even think Christine was either. That's what bothers me with missing children, you lose valuable time in screw ups. To me, it's always better to have the answer than to spend decades wondering so get it right the first time. Look at the time and money wasted on Guy Paul Morin all because he wouldn't help search and thought he needed to be invited to her funeral.
I've often had another thought, not a pleasant one but I wonder if they were able to examine the elevator shaft carefully. Although I know from what I saw she isn't in there.
At least Louise knows what happened now that's she's passed. I often thought of her and how she must have ached for her missing child.
 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: capeheart on December 31, 2008, 10:12:37 PM
Well the way I feel about this case is that within the first hour or two that she went missing, this floor should have been taken over by every available police officer. I am willing to bet she was abducted and taken into an apartment and later at some point removed from there. That is when a list of everyone who lived on that floor should have been provided. But she could have got on the elevator and the person took her right down to another floor. So much to wonder what happened to Nicole. A long time past and no answers.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on January 01, 2009, 10:16:41 AM
I think it would have been too late by that time Cape. She wasn't discovered missing till later in the afternoon if I remember right. Whoever took her could have been long gone by that point. What should have been done however is a more aggressive investigation of the occupants of that building. I agree they could have got off on another floor but they didn't go out the front door if there was video surveillance.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Spartacus on January 22, 2009, 11:29:00 AM
The World Wide Church of God, which Art and I have in common, has a Vesica Pisces logo. It's a very Davinci Codish symbol which this case shares with the most famous abduction of the 20th Century--the Kidnapping of the Lindbergh baby in 1932. The ransom notes from that kidnapping was signed with a Vesica Pisces. (http://www.christchan.org/k/src/121387630786.jpg)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on January 22, 2009, 12:28:20 PM
This piece of information while interesting  is supposed to tell us what? That Nicole was destined to be kidnapped? She left a note saying she was going to be kidnapped that was virtually ignored by the police. I'm not sure what significance this logo is supposed to represent but I still maintain and always will. Nicole wasn't taken by a church member. I doubt this man ever saw the inside of a church even as a child because if he had of he would never have grabbed her.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: capeheart on January 22, 2009, 02:29:04 PM
Well, to heck with the da Vincie code or whatever, or the pices sign, it all comes up as hocus pocus at this time. Not enough was done immediately when it was found out the child went missing. A detailed list of everyone who lived in that building should have been acquired within an hour and I am sure it could have been done. As soon as they had the list of everyone who lived there, then they could narrow it down and bingo, I bet 100% that they would have the killer within the first 48 hours if not less. Why is so much time taken in these cases when it is just common sense that should prevail and the obvious be done. Yet there is a lot of yinging and yanging and back and forth, when there should be some kind of a listed format when someone goes missing from a building. If they were not seen outside of the building, then there is a great assumption that they never did get out of that building on their own free will. EVERY APT COMPLEX SHOULD BE SEARCHED RIGHT TO THE CLOSETS, UNDER THE BED AND ALL. Remember little Jessie in the states who was murdered right behind her grandma's house. They went into that home and Jessie was being hidden in the closet, he was a sex offender and they did not even search that home. The family knew he had that little girl there, they had to. That is a haunting case if ever there was one. Things have to be done immediately when finding the child is gone missing and in this case it was obvious she did not leave of her own free will. Those are my comments. 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: lostlinganer on January 22, 2009, 03:32:45 PM
I agree mauve; when a child disappears, there should be no such thing as warrants etc.  ...just knock go through every door where she could possibly be/have been, and go from basement to attic - every house around with every blood hound available.  Authorities wouldn't think twice if it was a policeman's or politicians child .... or an important Diplomat.  Who or what garners any more immediacy than a missing child?  I don't care if they are missing minutes, hours, days or weeks;  a child in the most "vulnerable of vulnerable" - instantly the whole population should shift into rescue mode the minute a child is unaccounted for....the concept is very simple .... just pretend it's the Prime Mininster.

On second thought, I wouldn't waste 5 minutes looking for the Prime Minister if he was missing a decade.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Spartacus on January 23, 2009, 07:00:19 PM
Art's great neice, Kristin Morin believes his church theory holds the key to the crime. You can read her comments on her facebook group. A friend and fellow church member at the time joined the group and is interested in the theory but doesn't think they would have acted without Art's consent.
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2299651105 (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2299651105)
So far, this site has the most up to date and comprehensive information on Nicole's disappearance but one has to keep trolling the other pages to find anything new. I hope my contribution helps keep this updated. The logo of Art's church should have more direct relevance than Guy Paul Morin. Unless you're talking about someone who knew Nicole Morin reading about Guy Paul Morin in the newspaper and getting ideas about getting in the news.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: mauvelilac on January 24, 2009, 12:48:25 PM
Quote
Art's great neice, Kristin Morin believes his church theory holds the key to the crime. You can read her comments on her facebook group. A friend and fellow church member at the time joined the group and is interested in the theory but doesn't think they would have acted without Art's consent.

Spartacus had you explained this when you posted the logo we would have had a better idea of which direction you were going in. I belong to the facebook group of Nicoles but that doesn't mean I buy into the church theory of her kidnapping. Not everyone has seen this group or belongs to it. You threw it (the logo) out without any explanation as to what or how it might be helpful.

Quote
I hope my contribution helps keep this updated.
Everyone's contribution on the site is  welcome and helpful in some way.

The mystery of Nicole's disappearance starts in the fact that why would an eight year old leave a message that she was going to be kidnapped? Obviously, someone untrustworthy had gained her trust. Was it a church person? I don't believe it to be. But just say for the sake of those who do believe it to be so, who had a bone to pick with the Morins? Whoever took this child didn't do so because they wanted a child to love and cherish and I know this for a fact because of information given to me recently.
If you want, look to your church. See who among you is capable of this malicious act because that's what it was, a malicious act. To take an only child from her parents and make them wonder for years, chase across the country on false information in an effort to locate her only to have their hopes dashed is cruel and malicious. You're welcome to your church, if it was indeed a church member. I wouldn't want any part of it.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Foamhead on April 19, 2009, 02:30:28 AM
I remember this case back in 85, even all the way in Moncton and for some reason it has always stuck with me. What strikes me about this case is that people seem to like speculating all these scenarios and overlook the simple and likely truth of the matter. Nicole was walking in the hall of her building in a bathing suit and someone in the building snatched her, abused her and likely murdered her. Get a tenants list from her building and one of those people is her killer. I would bet any money that her body is still in the area as well since she was both taken and killed on a whim and the murderer wanted to get rid of her remains asap. Were I the police at that time I would have gone over every single person in her apartment with a fine tooth comb and grilled the ones who were not present during the search.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: peripeteia on May 01, 2009, 04:42:59 AM
Sadly I remember Nicole gone missing very well, I found the interview with the parents at the time a tad distrubing, in that I found the Father's statements iffy, however he has passed a polygraph, but somehow I thought he knew something.  Pardon me for my thought, it is what it is, I cannot help these, they just come.  I am not ashamed to say that I found the Father's behavior odd.  In fact I turned off the sound and watched his body language.  I am not saying he is involved at all, only that he had information that he was not revealing.  Perhaps the murder of his sister made him suspect his brother in law, now deceased, but there was something not right in this demenour.  That said, it is a terrible thing he and his wife have endured, their child missing.

Examining the list of occupants and their relatives would have been the best bet, and the woman in the lobby, also, I felt that Nicole could have been nabbed in the elevator, and taken to the basement parking and out the building without ever going to the front lobby, thus it could have been a visitor to the building, delivery, moving, etc.

I was very surprized when the suspect was arrested, I did not think he was guilty, and 10,000,000 dollars later the government paid for their mess-up says this is so. 

It is remarkable that Nicole stated that he was going to be kidnapped, this is very odd indeed.  There must be some basis to this declaration, surely such a small child does not come up with anything so fantastic.  Had someone approached her before and scared the bejesus out of her, and when she told adults it was poo-pooed.  Was the child watching too much TV and saw a child abduction case; and interesting she says kidnapped, and not murdered.  Something happened to imprint that thought in her mind, I do not believe children drag things out of thin air to feed their imagainations.  Granted children have wild thoughts, but usually there is some basis in reality.  It might be noteworthy the date of the letter Nicole wrote.  Perhaps someone said to Nicole, would you like to come and live with me, something to that affect, or she saw something on the news that gave her the ideation of kidnapping.

Sorry if my thoughts are offensive.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on June 10, 2009, 03:09:57 PM
I have been debating with myself for a couple of days now whether or not to post this about little Nicole Morin.

I worked at the corner of The West Mall and Burnhamthorpe during this event. I took the 427 south to work one morning because I was late for work, generally I did not take the main highways because I disliked driving on them at that time. When I arrived at work one of the secretaries told me that a child is missing. Being in a busy office phones started ringing, people coming and going so I forgot all about it. When I left work that day I took my usual route home, north on The West Mall. As I drove along a sense of urgency started to build up inside of me and I could not figure out why it was there, or where it was coming from. It grew stronger and stronger as I kept driving until a little girl’s face flashed through my mind. When that happened I automatically turned my head to the right and stared straight at a small corner window, where a tree was growing alongside it, of a low rise apartment building. I kept driving and when I stopped at the stop sign the urgency became a continuous tug inside of me. Something was telling me to go back but I pushed it aside and continued on. As I kept driving the urgency inside of me became a crescendo and started to really upset me. It was as if a strong magnet was trying to draw me backwards, and I was fighting with myself on whether or not to turn back. Heading East on Eglington I became aware of spread out Police Officers on horseback riding through the swath of grass along the road. That was when I remembered the secretary telling me about a missing child and the Police where there searching for her. The pull to turn back was enormous and for a while I debated with myself to pull over and tell the Police. But tell them what? So I kept driving until the urgency and anxiety inside of me was so bad that when I spotted an Officer on horseback near the side of the road on impulse I pulled over and started to walk towards him over the grass. The young Officer, in his mid to late twenties, approached me and before he could say anything I yelled, “You have to go back! You have to go back right now!” Because I was yelling, at first he looked startled, when I yelled again, “You have to go back!” He started to turn, then caught himself up and continued to stare down at me. It was quite windy that day and the tires of the passing cars at rush hour were loud but that wasn’t why I was yelling. Then out of my mouth popped, “she’s alive but not for long.” We stared at one another until I said. “Your horse is standing on my foot.” He looked down and sure enough the horse’s front right hoof was standing on top of my right foot. Aghast he said, “oh, sorry” and pulled on the reins whereby the horse moved off my foot. I turned and walked back to my car and drove off. The further away I drove the urgency and anxiety inside myself dwindled away and I berated myself for being and making such an ass out of myself all the way home.
While cooking dinner the TV news came on about the missing child, Nicole Morin. Then I really began to berate myself because she lived in a high rise not a low rise.
The next morning, in that halfway state of being fully awake and asleep, an image appeared to me. A room which was very peaceful, very calm, very clean, very orderly and precise. There was a window with open weave lace curtains gently blowing in the breeze. The bottom of the curtains brushed back and forth across the top of a wooden chest set under the window. Every time the curtains blew outwards the wonderful scent of perfumed flowers filled the room. Further into the room to the right, from the knees down, and standing sideways were two sets of men’s pants and shoes facing one another about two feet apart. To the right was a heavy pair of black shoes, shiny but worn with deep indents across the top and scuff marks at the tip of the one I could see, the pants were dark blue with a red stripe down the side. Instinctively I knew it was a police officer. Facing him was a pair of brown slacks, dress slacks, with a sharp crease down the front, resting on top of brown leather shoes with a black heel and black sole. Very shiny shoes, I had the impression they were new, because they did not have the top indents nor any marks on the one shoe I could ‘see’, with dark brown laces and a darker brown plastic at the end of the laces. But on the one lace I was able to ‘see’ at the end of the brown plastic the shoe lace was frayed and a longer thread was trailing down the side of the shoe, the other plastic shoe lace holder had no fraying which was higher up than the other one and resting on top of it. Both of the men were standing on top of a clean and shiny light wooden parquetry floor. Behind the brown shoes, about six inches behind, there was a wide, about a three inch, scuff mark on the floor which gradually became a long thin scrape which became a deep running gouge. At the time I thought how odd to see a mark like that on a pristine floor. I sensed that the two had an easy conversation, I also sensed that the man in the brown pants had his hands in his pockets. At the time I felt the urgency inside me return and silently urged the officer to look around the right side of the man towards what was under the window.  Then the picture went poof and I was wide awake and upset inside of myself, again. I dressed and headed to where my long time friend worked at a dealership. When she saw I was upset she took me out for a coffee and I told her what had happened the previous day and my wakening ‘picture’. After I had finished telling her out of my mouth popped, “she wouldn’t be found for a long, long, long time.” And to date Nicole has not been found. We discussed different scenarios on  what I should do, but I kept coming back to the, ‘she’s a nutbar, take your meds, get stronger meds etc., so we did not do anything. My friend is the only one I have told this story to up till now. But what I did do for about two weeks, every couple of days was either stand at the corner of the stop sign or near the low rise apartment building and stare at men’s shoes as they passed me during the morning before work, lunch time or during rush hour. Once my friend and I stood for hours on a Saturday, from noon to about four in the afternoon, going back and forth between the stop sign and the low rise building but I never did see those brown shoes with the dangling thread pass by.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Chris on July 15, 2009, 09:40:35 PM
That is quite remarkable. A reason why we should trust our intuition. I am not sure if the info is of any use now or not since it would be of no use in court. But it might perhaps explain what happened.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on July 22, 2009, 10:21:21 AM
Does anyone know if the time-line for when little Nicole went missing is correct? And does anyone know her birth date, time and place? I have asked some-one to look into something for me, and she has agreed, but I need to make certain all information is correct.Anyone out there know?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: capeheart on July 24, 2009, 07:15:03 PM
So Sleuth, am I getting from you that you think it was a person who impersonated a police officer that was responsible for the disappearance of Nicole. As you stated you feel that it was police clothing and shoes that you had seen in your dream or vision, or do you believe it was a police officer?????? Just wondering. You do have a gift and that day, you should have went back and followed you intuition. But you know, it may not be too late to speak to a cold case detective and tell him your story. A detective that has an open mind, I would. It is a clue that may be very helpful in solving this crime.  ??? ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on July 24, 2009, 07:48:52 PM
No Capeheart, I don't believe someone was impersonating a police officer. What I 'saw' was a person, (male), being interviewed by a police officer. I didn't 'hear' anything but that was the sense of feeling I got. And yes you are right, I should have gone back. Do I regret not going back? absolutely.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Woodland on October 11, 2009, 02:17:54 PM
I can't help but look at the last person to see Nicole alive.  This is standard practice today.

Stuff happens during a painful break-up - kids get caught in the middle.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Fraser on November 02, 2009, 04:07:54 PM
Sleuth - I completely understand your sense of dread...there is a case of a serial killer who was caught. Before he was caught, I was reading a newspaper story about a young girl who had died, supposedly from drinking too much and I had a horrible intuition and knew without a doubt that she had been murdered. I didn't call the police...I wanted to, to tell them that the inquest was wrong and that the girl had been murdered and that they needed to go back and reinvestigate but I figured they would think I was smoking bad dope (which I've never done in my life). Years later I asked a policeman friend if they would have listened to me and they said "probably not".
Eventually, after the killers had been caught for other murders it came out that, yes, the young girl had been one of their victims.
To this day, I feel ill thinking about it.
One thing that strikes me about your story, as I read the part about wanting the policeman to look by the window, all I could think of was Dennis Melvyn Howe (he is wanted, including interpol) for the murder of Sharin Morningstar Keenan I believe....makes me  wonder....again, just intuition.

This is only one of the "intuition" events that has happened to me and it is why I am on this site.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: never_lose_hope on January 07, 2010, 04:40:24 PM
I wonder why police have not (maybe they have) gone back through the tenant list of the building in 1985 and cross check to see if any of those tenants have since been convicted of Rape/abduction child endagerment etc. criminals don't just commit single crimesm so why not investigate this way? They can interview those people/ polygraph them  and maybe they can finally find closure.

-Crystal
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on March 04, 2010, 05:19:52 PM
I have always found Nicole Morin's disappearance very troubling.  It has always bothered me that this little girl was riding alone on the elevator on that day, perhaps this was a common occurance..that I don't know.  But I do feel that somewhere on her trip to the lobby to meet her friend, the elevator stopped on a floor and someone snatched her. 

I too wonder if the Etobicoke police have ever checked the tenent lists.

After all these years, her body has never been found..where did she go?

Am
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Woodland on March 04, 2010, 06:40:59 PM
am - I find it impossible to 100% believe Nicole was ever on that elevator - imo it was less than 50%.  I would like to believe it was not a common occurence - at least it should not have been.  Many awful things had happened in Toronto by that time - some fairly recent to Nicole's disappearance - a mother should have known better - or could use it to her advantage.

Mommy was not in the best of circumstances and she was the only one ever to give a story on what happened - not one witness to Nicole's trip to get the mail and the intercom conversation with Nicole's friend could have been anyone.  Nothing is more demanding than being a single (working?) mom - if there is only 1 child at the time - a very lucky break - 2 is a much tougher go.

Not sure a tenent list is the answer - mommy had all night to do something, if in fact she did.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on March 12, 2010, 06:09:57 PM
Woodland, Nicole's mother and father were separated.  Nicole's mother was at home the day she disappeared but was babysitting smaller children and didn't escort her to the lobby.  It was verified by the police that Nicole's friend did buzz the apartment to go swimming.  She waited, but Nicole never arrived.  It is my understanding both parents were cleared of any wrong doing.

Yes, at the time there had been a few murders of children over the years in Toronto ..but not in the West end ( Etobicoke)  Nicole lived on the West Mall, we lived on the East Mall, HWY 427 both run north and south.  A bridge on Rathburn road spans the 427.  There are on ramps to the 427, located on both sides.  From there it's 2 minutes to the 401 which runs east to west and connects all majors cities..to Montreal in the east and far west as well as connects to the USA via Niagra Falls..it's also 4 minutes north on 427 to Toronto Airport.   

 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Woodland on March 12, 2010, 07:47:26 PM
Would like to believe Nicole was taken by a stranger, but find it difficult.

Toronto Star headlines, 1 August 1985, 4 days after Nicole's disappearance -
'I know someone's killed her' mother of missing girl says - quote from Nicole's mother.  Others around her might venture to think that in so short a time, but I would have expected her to still be clinging to hope after only 72 hours (she was quoted from the day before).

On Sunday, she makes a public plea, 'let her go, she's innocent'.  No mention of being misquoted the day before.

I have difficulty that Nicole was taken from the elevator on a split second decision by someone, and nothing was dropped - her towel, a shoe etc - and no screams were heard.  How do you struggle to keep someone quiet and pick up items as they drop along the way?  Two people would be needed.
Then there is the difficulty of exiting a sizable apartment building with a large package, unseen by anyone when the police start knocking on doors.

It seems to me, the cleaner the abduction site, the closer to home the perp is.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on March 13, 2010, 05:09:50 PM
Woodland, I understand your points but I tend to disagree. 
Nicole was very sociable, had lived in the  building for quite some time, knew many tenants and had numerous friends.
Who is to say that went she left her apartment for the last time, on the way she decided to stop at the floor of another friend for swimming?
Nicole was 4 ft tall and 51 lbs and would probably fit inside a gym bag. Anyone could have exited the building carrying a gym bag and gone un-noticed as over 6 hrs had lapsed from the time Nicole was last seen and when her mother realised she had never tagged up with her friend.
Holly Jones killer transported her body in a gym bag.
No, no article of clothing was ever found but she wasn't wearing very much.
As for the Toronto Star quotes not being corrected by her mother.  If I had a missing child the last thing I would be doing would be checking the papers to see it they were quoting me accurately.
As for no one hearing her scream..why would she scream?  She probably knew and trusted her abductor..or she froze and was afraid.  How many times have we heard of small children willingly going with a total stranger.
And it doesn't take two people to subdue a 51 lb child.
Both parents were cleared in this case but the fact remains Nicole has never been found.
 
 
 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Fraser on March 13, 2010, 06:41:57 PM
AmIam - I agree with you on the gym bag part...I am 4' 10" and when I was much slimmer I could fit into a duffel bag ( we did it as a joke experiment one time). The person could have easily rendered her unconcious thereby eliminating any struggle.
As for the first quote from the mom, as horrible as it sounds, sometimes, in spite of all hope, a mother knows.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: lostlinganer on March 14, 2010, 10:49:28 AM
I can't help but wonder.... since this appears to be an isolated event in that building:
What pedophile or other child predator may have lived or visited that building at that particular time.  ....wonder if they had access to either or some other quick silent means???
I wish there were old tenants, from that building, reading this site. ::)
It just seems like authorities "dropped the ball" on this one too.... and the parents would have been too distraught to clue in that day. 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: never_lose_hope on March 14, 2010, 03:13:53 PM
That's what I was saying lost... maybe they didn't know then that thre were child predators in the building but to go back now over the tenants list I'd bet dollars to donuts you'd find someone with a record who wasn't really intereviewed back then.. but people get sloppy and caught..
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on March 14, 2010, 03:31:10 PM
Maybe Nicole was taken by an older man, a parental figure, maybe by someone the parents knew. Which means Nicole would probably have had contact with this person in some form, even if it was slight as in seeing him with her parents at times.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on March 14, 2010, 04:11:26 PM
Fraser, so there you go..if you at 4' 10" could fit in a duffel bag it would have been very easy to do the same to an unconcious child.
Yes, I agree sometimes a mother "knows" however I have not personally read the Toronto Star report..it was just stated here.
I personally am not in favor of newspaper quotes as I have been a victim as a result of personal tragedy.  I was quoted in the Toronto Sun and learned weeks later what was "quoted"


 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on March 14, 2010, 04:19:11 PM
Sleuth, I am not certain but I believe everyone the parents knew were cleared.  However, was involved in a local church and there has been some speculation over the years that perhaps the church was somehow involved.  Personally, I doubt it but you never know..given what we now know reagarding churches and some members.

Maybe Nicole was taken by an older man, a parental figure, maybe by someone the parents knew. Which means Nicole would probably have had contact with this person in some form, even if it was slight as in seeing him with her parents at times.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: debbiec on March 14, 2010, 04:30:02 PM
Maybe Nicole was taken by an older man, a parental figure, maybe by someone the parents knew. Which means Nicole would probably have had contact with this person in some form, even if it was slight as in seeing him with her parents at times.

I agree with your thinking on this sleuth. It would certainly be possible that Nicole's parents may have known the person that took her, even if only casually. There is the possibility that he could have lived in the building. Even if Nicole's parents did not know him personally she may have seen them interact with him, say in a laundry room or even in the lobby while getting the mail. Children are very trusting also and even if they have just seen someone around they often feel like they know them.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on March 14, 2010, 04:37:35 PM
There are a cluster of high rises where Nicole lived.  In 1985, when she disappeared these buildings were very high end luxury apartments. Nicole lived in what was termed the "penthose." Many of the folks that lived there at that time were very well off.  I don't know how well the police investigated all the tenants or even if they did.  It was 1985, bad stuff never happened in Etobicoke..it was a very wealthy area.
For a time the police were searching for a well dressed woman seen going door to door in the building with a clipboard but she never came forward.  There were no reports she ever contacted a tenant..she was just seen in the hallways.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on March 24, 2010, 01:17:32 AM
A while back, sometime last year, summer, late summer?, a new comer posted only one post on this thread. Then early the next day she removed it.
What she had to say was interesting. She mentioned that she? or a friend? of hers on the way home from school? for lunch? or after School? was approached by a man, in front of or near where Nicole lived, and offered to buy her candy. Her friend became frightened and ran away. The poster mentioned the man had brown hair and that there was a Tuck Shop in one of the buildings. I think it was before Nicole was taken.

I wish you would come back Ms Poster and repost your message again.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on May 15, 2010, 06:23:12 PM
Sleuth, that would be so great if that poster would repost her experience.  This seems like such a vital clue and may be very valuable.

I didn't know Nicole, we moved to the area in '87, my son attended J/K at Wellsworth PS, the same school Nicole attended. I knew Nicole's teacher, she was so devasted at Nicole's disappearance.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Grandma on July 04, 2010, 07:54:26 PM
About two summers after that little girl's disappearance I was packing to catch a train for a short family visit.  The t.v. was on in my bedroom and the news was on.  It was one of those New York State channels from Buffalo, Rochester or Syracuse.
The story was about a cache of child porn magazines siezed by authorities.  The camera showed a stack of these mags and the top one had a head shot of a little girl who looked just like Nicole Morin except she was very heavily made up to look older.
  I phoned the police and described what I had seen.  The policeman took all the info I had.
I didn't hear anything back.  I just pray that they were able to follow up on that. 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on July 15, 2010, 03:25:41 PM
Hello Grandma, welcome!  I am now one also but at the time Nicole disappeared I was just the mother of a child who attended Wellsworth Public School.  So many years have gone by since she disappeared without a trace.  Thank you for reporting what you saw on the Buffalo area news.  I am not surprised the Etobicoke police...22 Division did not do a follow up with you.  They should have for unless some bored cop was watching the channel he would have no way of knowing futher.jsut a desk guy taking a report that perhaps is now buried, in a warehouse somewhere or just slipped off the desk into a basket.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Miss R on August 02, 2010, 10:55:50 AM
I can't imagine that it's been 25 years since Nicole went missing.  Here's an interview with her father:

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/842909--nicole-morin-s-disappearance-still-haunts-her-family?bn=1
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on August 04, 2010, 12:01:24 PM
Thanks for this Miss R, I too can't believe it's been 25 yrs.  I have never been able to understand how Nicole just disappeared without a trace. Her poor father and late mother had such
anguish and still so.  One would never have imagined something like this happening in such
affluent ( at the time) area.  The Toronto Star article also provides links to Facebook pages of groups.  Some of the comments truly bother me.  How can people be so cruel regarding her parents.  Both were cleared immediately regarding Nicole's disappearance. 

If anything, they should be jumping all over 22 Division for not contacting Tony Warr of the homicide squad until a week after her disappearance. 

I can't imagine that it's been 25 years since Nicole went missing.  Here's an interview with her father:

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/842909--nicole-morin-s-disappearance-still-haunts-her-family?bn=1
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Concerned on August 14, 2010, 08:31:20 AM
25 years...

in the article, Miss R, the following I feel are worth note in the thread:

Quote
However, throughout the 25 years of media attention, manpower and resources devoted to the case, including private investigators hired by Morin, not a single clue has emerged about what happened to Nicole that fateful morning.

Quote
Art Morin still believes she’s alive. Twenty-five years after his 8-year-old daughter Nicole vanished without a trace from her Etobicoke apartment July 30, 1985, Morin, now 71, has hope that one day he will hug his daughter again...“I really don’t like to think that she’s dead. But she hasn’t turned up. You could say maybe that I’m having false hope,” Morin says...“The first day Nicole went missing, I said Nicole is in God’s hands. Well, that’s where it sits, 25 years later,” Morin says. “I still have to hang on to some hope for the future. That maybe, maybe, she might still be alive somewhere.”

Even a private eye was hired:
Quote
However, throughout the 25 years of media attention, manpower and resources devoted to the case, including private investigators hired by Morin, not a single clue has emerged about what happened to Nicole that fateful morning.

Nicole predicted she was going to disappear:
Quote
After she went missing, a notebook was found in her bedroom with a note scrawled by Nicole that read “I’m going to disappear.”

There is a book:
Quote
Nicole’s case has taken several twists and turns throughout the years, many of which had been documented in the recent book Unsolved: True Canadian Cold Cases by Robert Hoshowsky.

A Facebook vigil continues:
Quote
If alive, Nicole would be 33 today. A Facebook vigil titled “Find Nicole Morin” still continues, with some of Nicole’s childhood friends, family and well wishers posting messages.

Nicole's case was featured in over 1,000 Crime Stoppers programs in over 17 countries within the last 25 years:
Quote
In 2001, an updated photo of Nicole showing her as a woman in her mid-20s was sent via the Internet to over 1,000 Crime Stoppers programs in 17 countries worldwide.

At one point her uncle was a POI, but since cleared:
Quote
At one point in the investigation, police travelled to Quebec to interview Art Morin’s brother-in-law, who was convicted of murdering Morin’s sister Gertrude in 1961. He has since died and police determined he was not in Toronto at the time of Nicole’s disappearance.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Miss R on August 17, 2010, 07:47:52 PM
Recap:
There is now an English version:  http://www.droitfondamental.eu/07-Nicole-Louise_Morin-EN.html

***

Timeline of the June 30, 1985 day:

11 AM, Jenny, Nicole’s friend buzzes the building’s apartment to tell Nicole she was waiting downstairs.

Nicole leaves the apartment to the lobby to get the elevators. 

She was clad in an orange bathing suit.  She had with her
-a peach coloured towel
- goggles
-white T-shirt
-pink hairbrush
-bottle of suntan lotion
-plastic bag

15 mins later, Jenny buzzes the apartment again and Mrs Morin answers.  Finding that Nicole hasn't arrived at the lobby by way of elevator, Mrs Morin figured perhaps Nicole was fooling around with the elevators, riding up and down or somewhere else.

Jenny waits for another half hour and then heads to the pool alone.

Not till 3 PM does Mrs Morin check for Nicole’s whereabouts and calls police.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: art-hu on August 17, 2010, 08:23:47 PM
Good work Miss R,

The I.D. is considered undeniable.  Nicole is incontestably a victim of Zandvoort. Very sad. R.I.P. Nicole.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Miss R on October 04, 2010, 12:20:47 PM
Bucke Bliechert in your post you stated:  I'm interested in the report of a slender blond woman dressed in white with a notebook standing at the end of the hall on Nicole's floor, 40 minutes prior to the disappearance.

And in the Zandvoort website again you stated:  A slender blond woman holding a notebook was seen at the end of the hall 40 minutes before the disappearance.

I do not have Robert Hoshowsky's, book, Unsolved:  True Canadian Cold Cases with me right now, but I recall a description of the very same lady was mentioned in the Nicole Morin case chapter, with a couple more details added regarding the outfit she wore that day.

It would be helpful if there's a forensic sketch artist who could look into this with the help of the witness and provide the public a composite of that said woman. 

Is it too late now?  Not really.  The white outfit would very well have been preserved by a photo and someone, be it a family member, a friend or co-worker, may still have that photograph.   I should hope this extra police work will be worth the while.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on October 04, 2010, 12:39:48 PM
In regards to the woman in white; At the end of the road was/the building is still there, a building where a Life Insurance company trained new people who came on board. These new recruits were sent out into the area to door knock to get experience, and to set up appointments for the more established LI sellers to go into their homes, apartments to sell Insurance. I will not put up any more info on this. If anyone is interested they will have to PM me.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on December 13, 2010, 09:33:59 PM
It would be helpful if there's a forensic sketch artist who could look into this with the help of the witness and provide the public a composite of that said woman.
Here is the sketch from the Find Nicole Morin Facebook group. She's known as 'the blond with the notebook' but Hoshowsky's book says she had dark brown hair. He also says authorities today don't even know if she was identified.

I tend to disregard this sighting as it came a couple of weeks into the investigation but Hoshowsky says the witness remembers the woman's presence as strange, which you'd think wouldn't be the case if she was a reporter who was there after the diappearance...Unless the witness couldn't figure out why a reporter would be standing at the opposite end of the hall from Nicole's apartment.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 03, 2011, 12:53:15 AM
At the North end of a dead-end street named The West Mall in Etobicoke are two identical high rise Condominium Buildings. Both buildings have an indoor swimming pool with an outdoor pool between and behind the buildings used by tenants of both buildings, along with the tennis courts and outdoor visitor parking and underground tenant parking for each building. One is numbered 625 and the other one is 627. Nicole Louise Morin, the only child of Art, from North Bay, and his wife Jeannette Morin, who were married for 12 years before the miracle birth of their daughter lived with her mother in the Penthouse of number 627, named Summit Rouge, with 429 units and three elevators. On the morning of Wednesday July 30, 1985 at approximately 11:00 AM Nicole left her Penthouse Condo suite wearing an orange bathing suit with gold and blue stripes. She also wore a wide green head band and red running shoes with white trim. She carried a peach towel and a white plastic bag. Inside the bag was a pair of green velveteen shorts with white trim and piping. A white T-shirt with a logo, a pink handled hair brush, swimming goggles with black and yellow trim and a brown plastic bottle of suntan lotion. Waiting for Nicole in the lobby was her best friend J. M., aged 9 whom Nicole had agreed to meet to go swimming in the Building’s outdoor pool manned by a female life-guard. J.M. watched the elevators move from the Penthouse to various floors to arrive at the lobby empty. After approximately 15 minutes J.M. buzzed Nicole’s mother who told her Nicole was on her way down. After waiting for a short time J.M. then headed to the swimming pool. A woman who lived on the 17th floor rode down the elevator with Nicole and watched as she walked into the lobby. The woman continued on to the basement where she got into her car and drove away. This woman was the last person to see Nicole. The Police do not know whether Nicole was abducted from inside or outside the building.
At approximately 3:00 PM Jeannette Morin phoned J.M.’s family only to be told that J. had not seen Nicole all day. Shortly afterwards neighbours helped Mrs Morin search for Nicole. At approximately 6:00 PM the Superintendent phoned the Police.
Between July 30 and August 4, 1985 the building was searched 4 times, individual suites with doors being removed from the apt’s of tenants/owners who were not at home. Washers and driers, (tenants had ensuite washer and driers), cedar chests and tenants/owners garbage were checked. Architecture drawings of the building were brought in with sump pumps, main drains, sewers being checked twice and all other hiding places. All cars coming and going where checked thoroughly and the drivers questioned. In all 5,000 people were talked with.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 03, 2011, 12:55:56 AM
On November 3, 1985 in a remote area of Pearson Airport a plastic bag was found containing a man’s black jacket and trouser’s with a July 31, 1985 newspaper folded to the story and picture of Nicole missing. The other items did not belong to Nicole.

Through the efforts of Art Morin funds were raised by selling carnation flowers and dinners to hire a PI who was renowned for finding missing children. The Police were not happy with this move on the Morin’s part, and publicly separated themselves from Mr Morin’s action.
On March 23, 1986, twenty officers who worked on the search were disbanded, due to not enough work for them. After four months only three were left to search.
By May 4, 1986 Art Morin had made the entire World aware that his daughter was missing by sending flyers with Nicole’s picture to various countries.
On August 4, 1986 a green headband was found in a field in Bradford. Jeannette Morin said it was not Nicole’s.
September 17, 1986 After another blitz on the building complex new information was given to Police which put a ‘different  outlook’ on the case. The Police would not say what this information was.
On June 24, 1987 Jeannette Morin thinks that Nicole was kept in the building for some time.
On July 30, 1987  The Condo which Nicole and her mother lived in was fully paid for. Art Morin paid for the Condo fees, (maintenance), taxes and $50.00 a week. Art and Jeannette had been separated since 1983. During the court hearing Art saw a young unknown female sitting at the back listening to the testimony, (seperation).   He never found out who this unknown female was. After attempts to patch up their marriage the couple officially separated about mid July 1987. With Jeannette moving out to live elsewhere in Etobicoke and Art remaining in the Condo.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 03, 2011, 11:44:19 PM
A woman who lived on the 17th floor rode down the elevator with Nicole and watched as she walked into the lobby...This woman was the last person to see Nicole.
Robert Hoshowsky says this witness lived on the 7th floor.

But here they're saying the woman lived on the 17th floor. If it was the 17th, then it's more likely to have been Nicole because there are only three floors above her.

**edited to remove facebook quote
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 01:25:00 PM
Which means that either somone is off on their time, or Nicole was dilly-dalling somewhere for some reason. It doesn't take 15 minutes, plus a few 'short period of time', which I take to mean up to five minutes, since young children are impatient, to wait for an elevator, get on it and ride to the bottom. With 3 elevators, I would say at the most it would take under 5 minutes depending on how busy the elevators are. Since it was the morning and most people are at work the elevators would have been mostly free. Except for children heading to the swimming pool, or elsewhere. And yes J.M. lived on the 7th floor.
A woman who lived on the 17th floor rode down the elevator with Nicole and watched as she walked into the lobby...This woman was the last person to see Nicole.
Robert Hoshowsky says this witness lived on the 7th floor.

But here they're saying the woman lived on the 17th floor. If it was the 17th, then it's more likely to have been Nicole because there are only three floors above her.

**edited to remove facebook quote
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 04, 2011, 02:49:53 PM
And yes J.M. lived on the 7th floor.

Up to now, I've been under the impression that J.M. lived in the other building. The re-enactment on youtube shows J.M. coming in from outside and buzzing in, not going out from the lobby and buzzing up. I guess the media and police didn't want to let everyone know where she lived.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 02:57:32 PM
J.M. was 9, probably for her own protection. I hope she is doing okay now. The dissappearance of her best friend had to have had a devestating impact on her, and has probably haunted her to this point in her life. I wonder what Nicole confided in her about?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on January 04, 2011, 03:31:50 PM
Sleuth, the information you provided, is amazing as I have never read this before.  I was also unaware that JM was from the other building. 
And a woman from another floor verified Nicole made it to the lobby.  This I did not know either!
I have always been of the opinion she was snatched somewhere between floors.
So in essance, the re-enactment of the crime years ago, is really just a crock??
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 03:47:48 PM
I have no idea if it is crock or not.................but with over 5,000 people interviewed I'm sure something was missed and not correlated with what the Police did know. To disband the Officers due to no work for them, who sifted through
all the statements given?
So in essance, the re-enactment of the crime years ago, is really just a crock??
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on January 04, 2011, 04:22:22 PM
Exactly Sleuth.  The info you provided mentioned Art Morin, though fund raising hired a " renowned"  PI. and at this point LE backed off.  The name of the PI firm is not mentioned.. not certain if you are aware who this was.  The name King- Reid and Associates rings a bell as most notable in Toronto.   Brian King was the president.  Unsure as to when or if this firm was in place at the time of Nicole's diappearance.
Brian King, did much investigation for Robert Baltovitch..wrongly accused of the murder of Elizabeth Bain.
As an aside and perhaps of interest if this PI firm is one and the same, said firm hires many retired former police officers......
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 04, 2011, 05:30:13 PM
Quote
Pay-Per-View - Toronto Star - Jul 30, 1987    ... The private investigator cost Morin $15000 plus expenses
Art wanted to hire Jay J. Ames who found Marlon Brando's son but he would have cost $140,000 dollars, according to a Google News article. So he probably did hire a local P.I.
I was also unaware that JM was from the other building.
Sleuth is saying JM was from the same building. I'm the one who thought it was the other building based on the re-enactment and all the stories that say she buzzed up right away.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 05:36:10 PM
Thanks for the info amIam.  :)
I am going to put up an article from the Globe and Mail, September 14, 1988  which is not found in other newspapers. The Police went to the States and talked to a man by the name of Lovie Riddle age 41 who has talked about taking children from Canada. I'm amending this.......after a gross sexual misconduct his diary was found in his car. This is a must read article. Does anyone know anything about this man?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 07:10:10 PM
From The Star. A picture of Lovie Riddle, and an article.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Fraser on January 04, 2011, 07:39:03 PM
From another web site...As I indicated above, I have to wonder if there was anything to his confessions as it seems he has not been charged with any of the  crimes. I won't be able to answer replies to this post as I will not be near my internet for a bit.

"This is from the Lewiston Daily Sun Saturday morning Sept 10th 1988.
Alabama man claims that he has killed as many as 30 people.
Riddle stated to Detective Peter Herring that he had killed as many as 30 people over the past 13 years.On Aug 24th he recounted to Herring details of numerous homicides and as many as 35 kidnappings in several states and Canada. On Sept 9th he told reporters the material was for a novel he planned to write.
Described as a transient who worked as a cook at inns in Boothbay Harbor and Jackson, NH.
An affidavit filed with the Bridgton District Court complaint states Riddle offered a ride to a woman walking along rt 302 in Fryeburg Aug 13th ('88)and then pulled off on a dirt road and forced her to commit a sex act.
Riddle told Herring in a 2 and a half hr interview of "participating
in and being present at numerous homicides" as a member of the Outlaws motorcycle gang.
The document said Riddle did not want his attorney present during the interview because he wanted to get help and not get out of jail."If it takes 50 or 100 years, get me off the street. Keep me in there till I die, if it will help.."
Herring read from the notebooks. In part,"In the last 13 years I've allowed this force at least 30 times. The same force that drove me to kill in '83 is driving me again"
"The defendant told of kidnapping children in the US and Canada" the affidavit said. " He indicated that he participated (in more than)35 kidnappings." Among the events described, the document said.
* kidnapping a 4 yr old from Tenn. and delivering him to Quebec.
*Kidnapping a girl named Nicolo aged 8 or 9 from Canada in '86 and transporting her to Texas where he believes she was killed.
*Killing of a male, mutilating his body and dumping it along interstate 10 in Beaumont.
*Shooting a female to death and throwing her young child into a river.
*Being present when a 17 yr old girl was beaten to death with a hammer in Tenn.
*Killing a female in Cape Cod by beating her with a soda bottle and leaving her body under an overpass.
* Beating a female in CT near Hartford.
* Killing two game wardens in 79 and burying their bodies in a field.

Assistant District Attorney Patricia Mador also outlined in the affidavit " a long record of violent crimes" Including convictions for grand larceny, assault with intent to ravish and fraud. She said he had over a period of time been arrested on charges of murder, obtaining drugs by fraud,jumping bail,failing to appear in court in response to a traffic charge, and numerous violations of parole as a result of the convictions. The defendant has a record in Florida,Alabama,Iowa and Illinois. He has also spent 2 years time for possession of a firearm by a felon." The murder charge was dropped. details were unavailable. History also included 2 convictions for contributing to the delinquency of a minor."
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 07:45:56 PM
Thanks for doing that search Fraser and putting up the link. This guy is from Bangor, Main.........I wonder if he lived near Stephen King...............
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 04, 2011, 07:54:55 PM
Thanks Fraser for doing the search on Riddle and posting the info. He belonged to the 'Outlaw gang'? He either has a very active imagination or was present at different times of different murders. Who thinks up killing two Game Wardens? Beating someone to death with a soda bottle? What say you all?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 12, 2011, 01:34:41 PM
Real perps almost never confess to these types of crimes. I can only think of Clifford Olsen and I don't know if he confessed before there was money offered.

New info: It's been confirmed that police questioned Art's friends from the church that had criminal records.

I always thought police should investigate the World Wide Church of God, since it's associated with the Bobby Fischer disappearance, and they, in fact, did, contrary to what I assumed. Thanks WCG for the information.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 12, 2011, 02:47:06 PM
Thanks for the new information Buble!  :) What about the Church members who did not have a criminal record, were they questioned? I also think Nicole left the Apt sooner than 11:00 AM. Maybe between 10:41 and 10:51 AM. Nicole was a very tiny girl. Her mother would not allow Nicole to go into the elevator by herself until she was able to reach the Penthouse elevator button. That summer Nicole had grown enough so that when she stretched she was able to press the Penthouse button with her finger tips. Ooooops, I'm modifying this to add; Also, within the basement level of this building were storage lockers, a recreation room, cable room, many utility rooms, electrical rooms, the chute (garbage), and laundry. Oooops again; the Police also said that the underground parking 'was a nightmare'.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 15, 2011, 11:13:49 PM
What about the Church members who did not have a criminal record, were they questioned?
It appears they weren't, if there were any. As for the crimes themselves, I was told they were only 'petty' crimes.

Art seems to have had more than a few friends at the four to five hundred member church. If there were any church members in the building, I guess they would have been questioned along with the rest of the tenants.

I like the church theory, and not just because it means she might still be alive. If your timing, and the witness is correct, then Nicole could have just walked out to meet with someone before her friend got to the lobby, and her friend was mistaken about talking to Nicole on the intercom. She obviously didn't need to buzz in since she lived in the building.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 16, 2011, 01:44:45 PM
I hope Buble that you are correct, that Nicole is still alive. But in my heart I fear not. I don’t know Nicole’s habits before she went missing. For example, Nicole grew that summer, enough to reach the elevator Penthouse button. After that growth spurt, was it Nicole’s habit to fetch the mail every morning about the same time? If so, that’s pretty telling in and of itself. Did Nicole have chores to do before she was allowed to go and play? How did Nicole and her friend meet up in the lobby to discuss going swimming together? By coincidence? Did her friend know that Nicole fetched the mail at the same time every day? And met her there? Did they both fetch the mail at the same time? Was Nicole’s friend already swimming and timed it to meet Nicole at the mailboxes? The Video shows Nicole’s friend fully dressed? If that is so, then Nicole’s friend was already either swimming and put her clothes on over her swimsuit (would she put clothes on over a wet swimsuit?) or had a swimsuit on under her clothes. But, in the video she was not carrying a towel. If Nicole’s friend was not wearing a swimsuit under her clothes, then she would have to go home and change, and not wait in the lobby for Nicole. So why did Nicole’s friend not go up to Nicole’s home with her and wait while Nicole got ready? What I’m wondering is after Nicole went missing if her friend became scared, and confused when being questioned by parents and then by Police. And either changed her story or missed out parts so she would not get into trouble. 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 16, 2011, 10:24:31 PM
How did Nicole and her friend meet up in the lobby to discuss going swimming together? By coincidence?
The two friends had arranged to meet over the phone. Max Haines' account says there were two phone calls after ten o'clock and he doesn't mention them talking on the intercom. I often wonder if that conversation over the intercom actually took place because I find it hard to believe in an abduction on a trip to an elevator or on it or even waiting for one.

I wonder if the police wanted to believe her friend's scenario because, with her friend stationed in the lobby and her mother upstairs, the possible, original crime scene would have been contained to the building itself, between the lobby and the penthouse. The only alternative was Nicole got to the lobby first and walked out the building to meet someone else, which opens up new possibilities but with no crime scene to work with.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 16, 2011, 11:33:21 PM
Thank you Buble for that information. I'm a fan of Max Haines, but never did read any of his writing's about this case. So, the two girl's made plans over the phone to meet up at 11:00 AM to go swimming. If Nicole left the apt before 11:00, and I believe she did, got on the elevator, rode down with a woman from the 17th floor, got off the elevator and walked into the lobby. Why then did Nicole not wait for her friend, if her friend was not there? As her friend waited for Nicole. That could be the reason her friend never saw Nicole get off the elevator because Nicole had already reached the lobby.
As an aside; in one of the newspaper articles a woman states that she saw Nicole, ''riding on the carousal'. I believe the woman made a mistake. However in another article a policeman states, that on that day, 'there were a lot of parents with kids running around' at the pool. Also isn't late August running into Labour day vacation time for a lot of people. So I would think that a lot of residents were probably up north at cottages etc. 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 18, 2011, 11:54:39 PM
Three things, firstly, my mind keeps coming back to Nicole's swimsuit. It was very colourful, and eye catching. Maybe she was the type of little girl who loved colour. Secondly, What was the route that the tenants generally took to get to the outdoor swimming pool? anyone know? Thirdly, did Art have any brothers, brothers-in law?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Buble on January 19, 2011, 01:10:46 PM
Art had a brother-in-law who killed his sister, Gertrude.

This happened in Iroquois Falls in 1961. The brother-in-law served 7 years, moved to Quebec at some point, was a suspect in Nicole's disappearance but was cleared and has since died. That's all we know.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 20, 2011, 12:28:24 AM
Thanks Buble. And Art did not have any step brothers, or his parents did not foster any boys, or they did not take in any boys and raised him, or there were no boys who considered themselves part of Art's family, or thought of himself as part of Art's family?  And what about on the Mother's side? How old was the superintendant at that time? Was he a full time super or did he have an outside job?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: FM on March 10, 2011, 07:46:10 PM
Here's the information on Art Morin's sister's murder.

Quote
LACHANCE, Conrad
Male, age 34, widowed
Crime: Murder
Victim: Lachance, Gertrude Henriette Marie1962/03/24; Ansonville, Ont.
Method: stabbing
(Murdered his wife)
Trial: 1962/10/01 - 1962/10/03
Supreme Court of Ontario; Cochrane, Ont.
Judge: Parker, W.D.
Execution fixed to: 1963/01/10
Recommendation for mercy: yes (jury)
Result: no Order-in-Council
New trial; reduced to non-capital murder
Reference: RG 13, vol. 1793 (1.1,1.2,1.3,2.1,2.2,2.3, 2.4),
file CC907; 1962-1963
Content: Correspondence, transcript of evidence, judge's
report, police report, photos, newspaper clippings,
psychiatric reports, condensed summary.
http://data2.archives.ca/pdf/pdf001/p000001052.pdf
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: FM on April 05, 2011, 12:01:47 PM
Here are some Conrad Lachance articles:

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=DDE0AAAAIBAJ&sjid=QvUIAAAAIBAJ&pg=4780,1678849&dq=conrad-lachance&hl=en

The second is from 1976 and involves a prison escape. This Conrad Lachance is the right age so I'm sure it's the same guy. He would have been in jail for another offense, I believe.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=l5kuAAAAIBAJ&sjid=tqEFAAAAIBAJ&pg=2908,1890371&dq=conrad-lachance&hl=en
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: kittykat220 on April 13, 2011, 09:51:33 PM
does anyone know what the families religion was, i am asking just to easy my mind on something. not asking for nothing!!!!
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on April 14, 2011, 05:39:22 AM
Welcome kittykat220.....Back on Posts #68 and #70 there is talk of the church....it is Toronto WCG (not sure what that stands for).....and the Pastor was Neil Earle.  You'd have to back through the posts to find more info that I might have missed, as I just took a quick look back for you.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: FM on April 14, 2011, 09:54:01 AM
WCG is the World Wide Church of God. In those days, Herbert W. Armstrong ran the denomination out of California. He was on the religious telecast, The World Tomorrow, and published The Plain Truth magazine. It was Art Morin who went to the church and theorized about the involvement of one or more of the members in 1987.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Deeds on April 20, 2011, 01:36:47 PM
Hello All! :)

I have a question...Does anyone think that maybe Dennis Melvin Howe and Lovie Lee Riddle Jr. are the same person... Dennis Melvin Hown being the man accused of the 1983 murder of Sharon Morningstar Keenan, 9. The Toronto Metro Police exhumed a body for sudbury ONT. thinking that Dennis who stole Peter Steven Sandersons ID but the remains are not his and they tracked him to Winnipeg but then nothing... Lovie Lee Riddle Jr. was known to be in that area after 1986 and in Lovie Lee Riddle Jr.'s 1988 "notes" he was quoted ,"In the last 13 years I've allowed this force at least 30 times. The same force that drove me to kill in '83 is driving me again" while talking about child murders in the U.S and Canada.  Lovie Lee Riddle Jr. has also taken credit for the murder of Nicole Morin, 8.  Dennis Melvin Hown is also known to police for having aliases...just a thought...let me know what you guys think or anymore info you can pull together.

Lates,
Deeds

*****I was asked to take down my second post but i will keep everyone posted :) - Lets bring her home!*****
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: art-hu on April 20, 2011, 08:05:27 PM
Dennis Melvin Howe may go by alias's, but I don't think he and Lovie Lee Riddle Jr. are the same..  They have Howes' DNA. I'm sure they do a check once in awhile.  No matches.??? I'm guessing.  I don't believe Howe to be a serial killer.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: solvy on May 03, 2011, 03:54:13 PM
Good find Deeds!  i think if all else matches up, as in dates missing, you should call it in.  The eyes , nose, and mouth are very similar.  The brows could have been shaped.  Sure looks like a good match to me, considering tha teh pic is computer generated anyway, so not perfect.  What say you all?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: debbiec on May 03, 2011, 04:07:22 PM

Great work Deeds!. I also see a resemblance. As solvy said, eyes, nose and mouth very similar. 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on July 05, 2011, 12:33:09 PM
Not certain if anyone is in agreement, , however bikers have a certain look that is unable to be missed.  Hard to miss a fellow or his babe sporting tats and ponytails.  Especially in a high end stuffy Etobicoke condo....
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Dina75 on July 17, 2011, 11:34:35 AM
I lived on the West Mall as a young girl in the mid 80's. It was a cess pool for perverts and pedophiles! Im guessing because of all the high rise apartment complexes, these people knew their would be lots of kids out and about playing! I had 4 "situations" happen in that area between 1984 and 1988. My first run in I was 9 years old in '84.
I also lived in the condo complex that Nicole went missing from. One thing that has neglected to be mentioned is that the buildings had a 2 level underground parking that was accessible via the elevators.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on July 25, 2011, 11:50:41 PM
Hey all, I'm new to this forum.

I've been reading this particular discussion for a couple of days now, through and through, and something has caught my attention several times, but no one else has mentioned it.

The word steak.

Several posters on here have shared notes, I believe that were a summary of some of the kills and kidnappings Lovie Lee Riddle had admitted to paritcipating in, that have clearly been copied and pasted from another forum that I found while researching this case.

This look familiar?

* kidnapping a 4 yr old from Tenn. delivering him to Quebec.
* Kidnapping a steak named Nicolo aged 8 or 9 from Canada in '86 and transporting her to Texas where he believes she was killed.
* Killing of a male, mutilating his body and dumping it along interstate 10 in Beaumont.
* Shooting a female to death and throwing her young child into a river.
* Being present when a 17 yr old steak was beaten to death with a hammer in Tenn.
* Killing a female in Cape Cod by beating her with a soda bottle, leaving her body under an overpass.
* Beating a female in CT near Hartford.
* Killing two game wardens in 79 and burying their bodies in a field.

Many, many times this has been posted on this forum. Yet not a single person has stopped and said "Umm, what's with all this talk of this guy kidnapping and murdering tasty cuts of beef?"

When I first saw the word "steak" used so many times, I thought maybe it was some criminal or legal term I wasn't familiar with, for victim or something. But the more I saw it (in the other forum I mentioned), the more I started to scratch my head. I became convinced that the internet was playing a prank on me, when I later found the word "cilantro" in someone's post, completely out of context with the rest of the sentence. Huh?

Intrigued, I started reading through every page of the forum (only about 4 pages in total) taking screen caps of all the instances of food-related words being bizarrely used to replace other words that posters had originally typed. I concluded the following:

Steak = girl
Cilantro = little (one person's post even said something about a "cilantro steak" named Nicole going missing. Huh.)
Grilling = sexual
Culinary = child
Burrito = job
juices = girl? (I only found one example of this, so I'm not sure... could have also been teen?)
microwaves = murder

There was also a word that was being used in place of "rape", although I can't recall what it was and I guess I forgot to take a screen shot of that one.

I also found a few other odd sentences with food words in them, although I couldn't figure out what they were...

"My heart damn near bled peanut butter."

and

"Nail someone bacon to a wall" (seemed to be used in a defensive way, in response to a mean remark by another poster)


Anyway. I'm just wondering, why are these specific words being filtered out of this forum? I've seen forums that automatically censor out swear words by swapping them with placeholder words... but never anything this bizzarre... or specific.

Little girl? Murder? Rape? Sexual? Child? Why are all these specific words banned from this forum that relates to Nicole's case? Why is some person, who is clearly interested in the case, enough so to operate and frequently post on a forum on the subject, hiding these words from being found on their website? I don't want to point fingers, especially if whoever runs that forum is also a frequent member here, but my first thought was... a suspected or convicted child molester or sex offender might not want those words traceable to their own self-made web content.

Any thoughts about this? Someone seriously needs to explain the food thing to me!


PS. I'd be happy to find the link to that other forum, as well as share the screen-shot images I have saved of all of the food words I found, if anyone doesn't believe me.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Trouble445 on July 26, 2011, 07:03:29 AM
Weird?
I did not read the threads mentioned before as I am fairly new here also, but saw your post so I did a web search and came across the same thing you did. The posts on two separate sites were by a person user name Deeds (who is listed in member list on this site) and another post by a person user name jmlh. There was also a third site. That was only one quick search, 2 seconds, I  imagine if I really put time into it I could possibly find more. I do not know what this means but now am very curious. I was informed years ago that certain groups (rapists and child molesters etc) do have code words or language that they use instead of the actual words on the web. The hair is standing up on the back of my neck right now. You may be on to something.
Deeds apologized: "Correction: I'm very sorry but there was a mistake in my post, the word Culinary should read Child". Since Deeds is listed on this site and may be the same Deeds as the other site, why not PM or email and ask what this is about. Or maybe Chris admin can come up with an answer/explanation about these strange posts. I'd like to know what is going on too.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Trouble445 on July 26, 2011, 07:43:41 AM
Cross:
Quote
PS. I'd be happy to find the link to that other forum, as well as share the screen-shot images I have saved of all of the food words I found, if anyone doesn't believe me

BTW cross I believe you!

Is it possible that Deeds is quoting remarks or documents by Lovie Lee Riddle? Just a thought. But then again, why would Deeds also use the word "Culinary" her/himself in their posts?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: art-hu on July 26, 2011, 07:54:49 AM
I believe Deeds has done a lot of research here, and the words are from a document. Re: Lovie Lee Riddle. These are words this killer would use in code. I would not read anything else into it.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on July 26, 2011, 09:34:41 AM
It's true that most of the examples of the word "steak" come from that document/ notes about Lovie Lee Riddle, but there were many other examples on the other forum of words being swapped with food words, and not just in regards to what LLR had confessed to doing. For example, one poster said "There seems to be cilantro interest in etc. etc.", where it was obvious the person was trying to say "little interest".

Also, I've seen a few other people post the same list from that document on this forum, and in some cases the word "girl" is there as it should be.... so obviously Deeds and a few others had copied and pasted that bit from the other forum I mentioned when they were researching other sites for info on Lovie Lee Riddle, but others were able to find the original source or were able to catch on and edit the post before putting it up.

I'm just surprised that after numerous copy-and-pastes, only one person (Deeds) FINALLY noticed that they had accidentally put in the wrong word and corrected themselves (where he said whoops that should say 'child' and not 'culinary')

It's all very strange.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on July 26, 2011, 09:41:33 AM
Several other posters, not just Deeds, shared the exact same text, but only a few of them actually have the correct words all in place (where 'girl' is actually there instead of 'steak').

I'll attach an example of a food word being used in place of another in other posts, not just the list of crimes LLR allegedly admitted to participating in.

It's just way too bizarre to ignore... sure, my first thought was that there must be something sinister at play here, but really I'm just curious to know what the heck is going on with those words all being censored out... of a forum that is specifically about a little girl disappearing and possibly being raped or murdered. Seems a little strange, don'tcha think?

Again, I don't want to point fingers at anyone.. just wondering why this has been overlooked by so many.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Trouble445 on July 26, 2011, 09:55:54 AM
cross,  Deeds does have an email address linked to profile on here and you can also PM Deeds also.
Chris @ admin might want to look into it as well. PM Chris to ask for look-see.
I agree it is very strange that words are substituted for other words, I mean why would "Cilantro" be subbed for "little"? Sounds like a code to me.

Is the forum, xxxxxxx, shut down that you found the posts on? I am having a hard time registering on it. (You have to register to do any search there I guess)

The "find maura murray" site may also be shut down as last post was more than two years ago may 14, 2009?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: lostlinganer on July 26, 2011, 10:09:57 AM
I too, was troubled with his use of the "steak" word.  So as to not appear stupid about such use of a word, I think I told myself this meant "someone who was a target" as in "steak out" or "watch".
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Trouble445 on July 26, 2011, 10:55:18 AM
cross:
I found another blog where the same posters are posting again.
I started to read the blog and then all of a sudden the posts looked written in Chinese and then the "mystery words" steak.. etc started to show up.
Something weird going on. It seems the blogs they post on keep getting shut down?


**link removed
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on August 09, 2011, 01:51:13 PM
These reports seem very much as the ones on Steven Truscott and what's his names unfounded nonsense.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on August 13, 2011, 10:23:22 AM
I wonder if there's any way to report a website to the police. I mean, obviously there MUST be a way, but I guess what I really mean is how seriously would anyone take it, and would anyone bother looking into it?

I just find it very unsettling that someone who is clearly so interested in the investigation of this and other cases related to rape/abduction/pedophilia/murder appears to be hiding something and being very careful not to be caught publishing words related to these crimes... again, on a discussion board that is specifically intended to discuss such things.

I had never heard of xxxxxxx, so thanks for sharing that. This is exactly the kind of person I imagine is running that discussion board... someone who has a seriously suspicious personal interest in homicide cases related to children. Gives me the wiggins.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Trouble445 on August 14, 2011, 06:43:06 PM
Deeds we are just curious about the word substitution issue. Can you explain about that for us if you will and why it is showing up on several sites.

It does seem very odd IMO and we are curious about it. Not pointing any fingers but curious why it is happening.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Trouble445 on August 15, 2011, 08:46:33 AM
Thanks Deeds for explanation but I still find it odd. ???
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on August 15, 2011, 09:54:57 AM
No need to get so defensive, Deeds. The only reason anyone even mentioned your name regarding the issue was that it was noticed by someone that you were the only common member at both discussion boards (or at least the only one using the same username in both). No one accused you of anything... or suggested you were behind something sinister... people just wanted to see if you or anyone else following the thread had any answers or thoughts.

Which is, you know, kind of the point of these types of forums. To discuss.

I really don't appreciate the hostility, nor the passive-agressive quotation of a word I used in my previous post. Just a friendly reminder that I had actually pointed out before that I didn't think that you were the one who originally inserted those words manually, but rather you had innocently copied and pasted something you found elsewhere, as a few others did.

And if anyone was wondering, "the wiggins" is basically like saying "the heebie jeebies" or "the creeps". And no, I don't get them a lot, but I tend to feel a little unsettled when I'm looking at materials related to missing persons and murder cases. Pardon my perfectly normal human reaction.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on August 15, 2011, 10:14:28 AM
Also, I realize that it may not be directly related to the Nicole Morin case, so I apologize for polluting this particular thread with it. The only reason I even posted it here to begin with was because this thread seemed to have a lot of copy-and-pastes from that page, by several users and not just Deeds. That's all.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Coral on August 16, 2011, 03:29:26 PM
To the person who took Nicole
Some people say that the person who took Nicole, may visit sites like this, for whatever reason.  If this is true, and you do come here, please give her back to her family.  There is nohing worse than not knowing.  If you killed her, and buried her somewhere, please, let the police know where she is. Send an annonymous note or email from a public library. Let her father give her a proper burial.  There`s probably no incriminating evidence left by now.  Just give her back.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: cross on August 21, 2011, 08:56:34 PM
Deeds, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding — when I said that bit that you quoted, I was referring to whoever was running that page... not you! I'm definitely not trying to say that you're a creep for being interested in discussing unsolved murders, because, well, I'm doing the very same thing!  :)

It was the first website I came across while researching Lovie Lee Riddle outside of this forum, and since you posted something you found there I'm guessing it was one of the first pages in your search results, too. I was aware right from the start that you were just another member who was fairly new and had shared info you found elsewhere on the web about Riddle without noticing the errors (which is what I'm going to call them from now on, because I'm not a conspiracy nut and it could very well be just a glitch in the server that person is using or some other explanation that is perfectly innocent). It seems like a lot of people on this forum agree that every detail counts when it comes to these types of crimes, so I just thought I'd point something out that seemed amiss to me. I'm very observant, but not paranoid — I promise!

I'm not in any way accusing you of being responsible or involved, and I'm so sorry if that's what you thought I was implying. Now I can see why you reacted the way you did, and I'd be pretty steamed, too! So, I say let's put this behind us and get back to the focus of this thread: Nicole!
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: eyeswideopen on September 10, 2011, 08:36:49 PM
Kitty cat you are absolutly correct.  I lived in that area when she went missing.  Not such a great area.  At the time my oldest was 9 or10 and I certainly didn't let her go out alone even before this girl went missing.  My daughter had a friend on the fourth floor of our building and she wasn't allowed to use the stair wells at all.  We had cameras in our building so I could watch her go down the hall into the elevator , and while in the elevator right to her friends door, which I always did.  If there were people I didn't know at the elevator she was called back just to be safe .  The area is even worse now.  Not to say it was one of the worst areas but certainly not a mucky muck snobby area as a poster posted on here.  It was expensive but not mucky muck and a fair amount of crime around as it is a large city.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: amIam on September 12, 2011, 02:20:13 PM
Just popping in here to say I've skimmed most of this thread, and I have read the FB group as well.
I have special interest in this case because I was the same age as Nicole when this happened and lived in the area.

I've noticed a few comments here stating the area was "upscale" this was not the case at all.
I've also seen the building she vanished from called something other than it's real name.
Nicole lived in the "Buckingham" that was the name of her building at the time.

I lived down the street just south of Renforth in the Grange.. walking distance, and attended school down the street.

This area was not great in 1985, it had been lovely in the 60's & 70's but by the mid 80's it was getting rough.
There were multiple housing projects on the West mall south of Renforth between my building and hers, and across the bridge over to the East mall was even worse, it was mostly Government housing over there, townhouses, the high rises on Capri.. etc etc.

I do question Nicole being allowed to walk around her building alone, because being the same age as her and in the same area I was forbidden to.
I really don't have a clue how she went missing.. it's bizarre and scary but the area I am sure held some of the clues, I personally feel it was someone who was local who knew her habits.
I have and do wonder about the mother as well to be honest.
As a mother myself, I would never wait 6 hours to find out where my child is.. even back in 1985 my mother had constant eyes on us!!!
There was A LOT of gossip in the area back in the day she went missing, a lot of parents felt similarly.

Toronto Police probably dropped the ball.

You sound quite familiar with the area and yes, the building where Nicole lived was called the "Buckingham" at the time.  The area was at one time quite upscale however a few years prior to Nicole's disappearance the area changed for the worst.  I doubt very much a resident of one of the Capri buildings or for that matter the townhouse area east of the East Mall just north of Renforth were involved. That particular townhouse was known locally as "Yucca Flats" ..I was never aware of the true name.

As for Mrs. Morin being negligent or perhaps involved:  Jeanette Morin, in order to make ends meet, baby-sat a number of smaller children.  (Nicole was quite the mature little gal and had numerous friends in the building and in neighbouring residential homes.)

Being a mother myself as well, I can't imagine the anguish Jeanette Morin must have felt over the years with the feelings of 'what if'..the woman has been deceased for a number of years and cleared, years ago while still living by LE of any wrong doing or involvement in Nicole's disappearance.

Gossip at the time was just that; gossip, to make reference Jeanette playing a part..IMO is just a witch hunt and very unfair.

 
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: GrailKnight7.5 on September 13, 2011, 10:27:15 AM
I personally do believe the Worldwide Church of God is a clue (Rose McGowan was in the Children of God). Bobby Fischer was in the WCG although his disappearance occurred after he denounced the church for sex scandals and false prophesy in 1972. (Wiki)

WCG and CG, both came out of the west coast and have many similarities, although CG was more hippie. Police would only have investigated the Church for member's with criminal records, not for suspicions related to their being a new and unusual sect.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: GrailKnight7.5 on September 15, 2011, 11:59:41 AM
Facts remain... her friend buzzed up and had not seen her come down, right there HUGE alarm bells. I would have had kids in tow and been off to look for my daughter.
The scenario of what happened that day has now come under question since it had come to light that the friend lived in the building (page 9). Everyone thought she lived in another building and arrived at the front door. That's what the media and the police led everyone to believe--that she came from another building.

In that scenario, they would HAVE to say she buzzed in and talked to Nicole and/or her mother, even if she didn't. We assume they were trying to protect the friend's identity. It also makes everything, they said happened, suspect.

The only person who likely told the truest version, was Max Haines and he doesn't mention talk on the intercom and he says she made it to the lobby (p. 11 and Max Haines, Collected Works) although he does narrate and appear on the youtube video re-enactment that shows it the way they always do.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: remembered on September 29, 2011, 07:43:57 PM
I was so young then.. 5 years about.  My older sister was 9 and we lived 5 minutes away from the pool.  I remember my sister had gone to the same school as Nicole and were friends.. don't know why Nicole's story came to mind today but its very sad to this day.  I wish she'll one day be found alive and well.  There are still people out there that wonder and hope the best! xo
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 26, 2012, 01:47:03 AM
here's something new, from Cal Millar's new book:

- Eight-year-old Nicole Louise Morin was on her way to meet a friend in an Etobicoke apartment building lobby when she vanished around 11 a.m. July 30, 1985.

She was dressed in a bathing suit and was carrying a towel. One of her shoes was found in the building's elevator.

"That was a horrendous case," Millar said. "My daughter was the same age; they actually shared the same birthday, and my daughter played in the re-enactment that was created for television."

One of Nicole's shoes was found in the elevator? That's new.

 Modifying this to say.........Ooops, forgot to put the link in from the Toronto's Metroland newspapers: http://www.insidetoronto.com/print/1284440
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on January 26, 2012, 05:18:47 AM
That is the first time I have heard about the shoe in the elevator too.  So, that leads me to believe, that yes, Nicole did make it to the elevator, she didn't go missing from the hallway.   But, then what?   How does one remove a child from the apartment building without being noticed?   I would assume Nicole must have struggled, if one shoe was left on the elevator.
Very puzzling.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 26, 2012, 11:01:33 AM
I understand what you are saying jobo, but then again the newspaper's did say that a woman from the 17? floor rode down the elevator with Nicole and saw her walk into the lobby, or through the lobby before continuing on down to the garage where her car was parked. A head scratcher that. I wonder who the journalist(s) were who wrote the articles for the newspaper when Nicole disappeared?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on January 26, 2012, 11:56:08 AM
Well....then I am thinking:  I cannot believe the woman that supposedly went down the elevator with Nicole did not see her shoe left behind when they exited.   And why would Nicole leave a shoe behind and not retrieve it if all was well?

What if:  Yes, Nicole and the woman rode down the elevator, but Nicole went/was forced back on it by the Perp and taken to an Apt. or Service Room in the Apartment Building? 
What if:  Nicole had forgotten something and went back on the elevator to quickly go back to her apartment?  And the Perp followed her on? 

For some reason, I have always been of the belief that Nicole did NOT leave the building that day.  And was murdered somewhere in that building, just not removed until much later, when the heat was off.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:37:49 AM
Either that or the woman was mistaken about the child she rode down in the elevator with. There are 3 elevators in the building.

I have some other newspaper stuff to put up and as soon as I figure out how to do it I'll put them up. I noticed Cal Millar was the journalist of most of the articles written for The star. So I guess he knows what he is talking about with the shoe being found in one of the elevators.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:53:08 AM
Let me know if this link works and if the picture is clear along with the article..

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jellybean on January 27, 2012, 01:39:44 AM
Good to see you back in full form Sleuth.  You were missed!!

JB
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on January 27, 2012, 05:11:17 AM
Thanks for the link with the picture.   
Interesting fact I didn't know:  Relatives from Northern Ontario that had visited before Nicole's disappearance, in fact they took the picture.  Obviously been cleared, but I just don't recall ever reading about the relatives.

Sleuth, do you think Nicole left the building that day?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:11:23 PM
Thanks Jellybean.   ;)  I did have kind of an inkling that Nicole made it out side. From what the woman in the elevator said, IF this is so. Watching Nicole walk across the lobby.  "walk across the lobby". Nicole's friend waited for her, for approximately 15/ 20 minutes. Nicole's friend watched the elevator doors open and close and no one got off. That narrows down the time span. A 15 to 20 minute time span, if either Nicole was early and didn't wait (why would she not wait, as her friend did for her?) or Nicole was early and encountered someone in the lobby. Or Nicole did go outside, using the front doors as a exit route.  On the North side is a little Tuck shop, still there, set back from the road, (the road is a dead end with a very wide turn around) set beside Nicole's building. Did she have money and decided to buy chips, pop or candy for her and her friend to take to the pool? We would have heard, or read if she had done so by a clerk in the store, ( I presume we would have heard, unless it's like the shoe, popping up years later). Or Nicole could have gone out the lobby and walked, south, taking the long way around to the pool. But why would she do that? To walk all the way around the building to the pool without waiting for her friend? If for some reason Nicole did decide to not wait for her friend but took the South route, she would have had to cross the 'Visitor's parking' to get to the pool. Which would be almost straight down the middle of parked guest cars. If the shoe was left behind, and Cal Millar is a very well respected criminal journalist, probably with inside information, he has now chosen to reveal about the shoe. Which then makes us all ask more questions.  If the shoe was left in the elevator, does that mean Nicole was lifted up and held against her will? Making one shoe fall off as she kicked? And then the elevator went straight down to the parking garage. If so, this means that the kidnapper lived in the building. Since the basement parking is for tenants only, unless a visitor used a relative, friend  et al parking spot. I've asked Cal Millar a couple of questions. He hasn't answered yet, if he doesn't in the next few days, I'll ask again, he is a busy man right now working on his next book about Russel Williams.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:16:43 PM
In this article it shows a picture of a smiling Nicole sitting down wearing the same shoes which she was last seen wearing. Nicole certainly was a pretty little girl. Her sparkling personality leaps out. And she's always smiling.


Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:23:07 PM
Here in this article of September 17, 1986 it talks about another blitz at the apartment complex and new information surfacing which takes the case in a new direction. I wish I knew how to upload these articles which appear in the post and then when clicked on just enlarge?



Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on January 27, 2012, 12:24:32 PM
What if Nicole was too early for the friend, and had walked across the lobby as the woman says....but decided to turn around and jump back on the elevator to perhaps get something she forgot, or to ask for some money for the store?  No one but Nicole would know that fact....but I do wonder if that is what transpired.
She got back on the Elevator, but at that point was followed, or the Perp was already on it and didn't disembark....just stayed in the Elevator when Nicole got back on.   That is why her shoe was left on the Elevator, she was grabbed the second time she got on.  Either taken to an apartment, boiler room etc.  Or taken down to the underground parking and wisked away. 

I do think someone in that building has held the answers all these years.  I would love to be able to do a Up to Date Criminal Check on all residents from that building from 1985, just to see what these people have been up to.  If any of them have been up to anything worth looking into more.               My opinion only.

OOps, typing at the same time!
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:28:14 PM
It certainly is quite possible Jobo. Every time new info pops up there are more questions than answers. Frustrating isn't it.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 27, 2012, 12:34:40 PM
 Here is an article where Nicole's mother thinks Nicole was held in the building somewhere for a length of time.




Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Logical on January 27, 2012, 02:39:48 PM
Hello, I am reasonably new here, have visited a number of times but only registered today. I recently took some PI training classes and our instructor was a former Toronto Police Officer, he referenced this case when discussing undercover operations.  I cannot recall all of the details he shared but he did say that they believe they know who took Nicole, they had him under surveillance within 5 days of her disappearance and watched him 24x7 for more than a month, LE could not get any concrete evidence to arrest, the undercover agent even point blank told the suspect he was the prime suspect and the suspect responded with only these words "But they do not have a body"! At this point they felt he was the sole suspect as he did not ask why or defend himself he just smirked with his response. The surveillance ended then and they just hope to get a new lead or some one locates her remains. Sorry I cannot remember if he said the name of the suspect but he lived in the building and had his own Graphics company.

I would believe that the Morin family is aware of this information and this may be the reason that Mrs. Morin feels that she was in the bldg for a long period of time, as he was a resident.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: breeka on January 27, 2012, 07:44:13 PM
I have a question i lived in the area where nicole went missing is it true that they found some of her clothing at the airport so they thought she was taken out of the country? is this true or false?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on January 27, 2012, 10:51:59 PM
Thanks for posting Logical. But why would an undercover detective blow his cover and tell the suspect he was the prime suspect? if only we knew who this person was and what became of him...I can only hope the police have kept tabs on him over the years if nothing else.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Logical on January 27, 2012, 11:13:46 PM
Leon, the under cover said that after 45 days they had tried many tricks to get info and as a last ditch effort the uc played the suspect and said the police contacted him to question him about the suspect and her disappearance.

I am not sure but think he is in another province or city but still being watched.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on January 27, 2012, 11:30:27 PM
Well I would think such a predator would likely strike again.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 28, 2012, 01:47:44 AM
Welcome Logical! :) What you have written is correct.   :)

Hello, I am reasonably new here, have visited a number of times but only registered today. I recently took some PI training classes and our instructor was a former Toronto Police Officer, he referenced this case when discussing undercover operations.  I cannot recall all of the details he shared but he did say that they believe they know who took Nicole, they had him under surveillance within 5 days of her disappearance and watched him 24x7 for more than a month, LE could not get any concrete evidence to arrest, the undercover agent even point blank told the suspect he was the prime suspect and the suspect responded with only these words "But they do not have a body"! At this point they felt he was the sole suspect as he did not ask why or defend himself he just smirked with his response. The surveillance ended then and they just hope to get a new lead or some one locates her remains. Sorry I cannot remember if he said the name of the suspect but he lived in the building and had his own Graphics company.

I would believe that the Morin family is aware of this information and this may be the reason that Mrs. Morin feels that she was in the bldg for a long period of time, as he was a resident.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 28, 2012, 01:50:55 AM
Clothing was found at the Airport but was not Nicole's, along with a man's clothing. I will put up the link to the newspaper articles.

I have a question i lived in the area where nicole went missing is it true that they found some of her clothing at the airport so they thought she was taken out of the country? is this true or false?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 28, 2012, 01:58:22 AM
Here's the link to the clothing story.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 28, 2012, 02:01:00 AM
If any one else wants any more articles up let me know since I have quite a number of them. on file.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 28, 2012, 11:23:18 PM
So now everyone's curiosity has been satisfied on the who, what and where, please don't stop posting.. The Police are still missing the 'link'. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Alainsblossom on January 29, 2012, 04:43:13 AM
Do you happen to have a photo of that suspect ?

are there any law enforcemnt at this site ?


Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 29, 2012, 11:00:17 AM
WelcomeAlainsblossom!   :) Please, no one put any photo's up of anyone UNLESS the person's photo has appeared in a newspaper, magazine. No one want's the heartburn of being in big trouble for posting pictures that have not appeared in a public venue. I'm sure law enforcement of some kind peruse this site.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on January 29, 2012, 01:24:17 PM
I think I'm missing something here in terms of the "who". Perhaps a post has been deleted. Also the newspaper articles are too teensy to read.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Alainsblossom on January 29, 2012, 04:38:56 PM
Oh ok ... I thought they had a suspect .
but I did not see a name or photo and thought there was one floating around!
my bad .
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Sleuth on January 29, 2012, 10:33:38 PM
It's not your bad Alainsblossom, there is a 'suspect'. But because the name and photo have not appeared in public, as in newspaper's, magazine's tabloids,  Television et al, therefore we can not put up names nor photo's of POI's. But I will put in point form some other stuff.

- One of Nicole's shoes was found in one of the elevator's
- The Police think the shoe was either kicked or placed into the elevator by someone (meaning if the shoe was left in the hallway on a specific floor, well that would be too easy to be caught, so probably the perp kicked it into the elevator before the doors closed. And then the elevator would go to different floors. Hence which floor at that time was unknown.)
- The Police think that Nicole was abducted from within the building
- Nicole's mother went to the same shop where she had bought Nicole's swimming suite to find another one just like it, but was unable to. Nor at any other stores.

Oh ok ... I thought they had a suspect .
but I did not see a name or photo and thought there was one floating around!
my bad .
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on January 29, 2012, 10:40:13 PM
It's possible the shoe was kicked back in the elevator but it's also possible it fell off during the abduction while Nicole was dragged out onto another floor, no?
Why is the issue of the bathing suit being all sold out significant?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: dagc on March 21, 2012, 05:51:41 PM
who knows what happened to Nicole there are so many possibilities, maybe it as a sexual predator, or maybe it was somebody who wanted a little girl cause they didn't have one for whatever reason, maybe somebody's child had died and they needed "another" so they wouldn't have to account for the death so they snatched nicole,

People who were in the building in the days before the dissapearance should be check out too, maybe it was a person going door to door trying to sell something while really looking into apartmans seeing if there is any sign of a child living there so they can choose a victim,
or it could of been a pedofile who had hung around at the pool and looked for the children who were unnateneded and then followed them inside to see where they live so that maybe in another hot day, he could go inside and wait. Or maybe  he heard the girls talking about their plan to go swimming that day, and then he could easily follow them into the apartman, see where they live, and then come the day theyre suppose to go swimming and wait.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Miss R on March 23, 2012, 02:22:52 PM
Maybe this is a dumb suggestion on my part.  LE could have been up to speed.  However, I have to ask. 

Did LE keep in track of all those who have been living in the building in 1985?  amIam mentioned that the building that Nicole lived was named "Buckingham", a West Mall apartment building.  That's the exact address needed.   

Perhaps LE could use the specific building address where Nicole last lived and cross-check the 1985 residents (and associates) and see if they would show up now in any police database.  Probably in 1985 someone was 'clean' but now may been charged with sexual assault, forcible confinement, or any crime against a minor.  Check their additional properties that they had ownership of at that time, be it a cottage or a small shack by the lake.

I guess they have been on top of this though after all this time.  Just checking.  Several of the posters in this thread did mention the same thing, checking a tenant list, but there's no word if LE DID actually do the cross-check.

For example, let's say, if Bell Canada currently had a 1985 Toronto phone listing in storage.  If their 1985 file is computerized and alphabetized by last names, that same file can still be converted and sorted by address.  Just select the database with that specific address and check everyone out.  However, those with common last names are going to be a problem.  *sigh*
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on April 05, 2012, 07:23:33 PM
I like your suggestion of continuing to find out what ever became of the people who lived in Nicole's building 25 years later. All part of never giving up on the case of a missing child.

I recently saw a poster of Nicole that was posted at a border crossing, so someone is doing their job in keeping the posters out there still.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: save_elephants on June 02, 2012, 02:40:20 PM
I was at my local Wal-Mart this morning (Calgary,Alberta) and noticed Nicole's missing poster up. It was nice to see that her case is still alive and you never know. Maybe someon seeing it after all these years will remeber something...
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: wellsworth on August 31, 2012, 06:58:22 PM
A while back, sometime last year, summer, late summer?, a new comer posted only one post on this thread. Then early the next day she removed it.
What she had to say was interesting. She mentioned that she? or a friend? of hers on the way home from school? for lunch? or after School? was approached by a man, in front of or near where Nicole lived, and offered to buy her candy. Her friend became frightened and ran away. The poster mentioned the man had brown hair and that there was a Tuck Shop in one of the buildings. I think it was before Nicole was taken.

I wish you would come back Ms Poster and repost your message again.

I believe I was the poster (I am a guy btw).  It was 1980-1982, I was attending Wellsworth Junior School.  That day, a police officer visited the class (I think I was in Grade 1 at the time, so I believe the year was 1982, but not 100% positive on this).  The police officer taught us not to talk to strangers.  After school, I went home by myself (which sounds crazy now these days).  At the end of the sidewalk leading up to the West Mall apartment buildings, I was approached by a man, Caucasian, mid-20s to 50s (my guess at the time was 30s), brown hair.  He pointed to the tuck shop which was located in between the buildings and offered me to buy candy.  Remembering the lesson taught earlier in the day, I thought it was a test of what I had learned.  I said no, and ran to my building which was the other building beside the one Nicole lived in.  I never encountered that man again.

Does anybody know how long Nicole lived at the building?  Because I think I have a picture of Nicole in my old classroom photo.  In the same photo is a girl named Jennifer, though I don't know if it's the same Jennifer, because she's Chinese.  She ended up going to the same high school as me 10 years later, but I never had the courage to ask her if she was the same Jennifer that knew Nicole.

Can anyone tell me how common it is for a grown man to offer a child candy?  If this is the same man, maybe length of tenancy at the apartment buildings is also a clue.  Perhaps a unit with a single man living in it.  All it takes is for a trusting child to be lured with pleas for emergency help.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: wellsworth on August 31, 2012, 07:11:32 PM
I lived on the West Mall as a young girl in the mid 80's. It was a cess pool for perverts and pedophiles! Im guessing because of all the high rise apartment complexes, these people knew their would be lots of kids out and about playing! I had 4 "situations" happen in that area between 1984 and 1988. My first run in I was 9 years old in '84.
I also lived in the condo complex that Nicole went missing from. One thing that has neglected to be mentioned is that the buildings had a 2 level underground parking that was accessible via the elevators.

Hi Dina,

I'm curious as to what "situations" you experienced?  What did the perpetrator look like?


I was so young then.. 5 years about.  My older sister was 9 and we lived 5 minutes away from the pool.  I remember my sister had gone to the same school as Nicole and were friends.. don't know why Nicole's story came to mind today but its very sad to this day.  I wish she'll one day be found alive and well.  There are still people out there that wonder and hope the best! xo

Was your sister's name Jennifer?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: SAP on August 31, 2012, 09:59:18 PM
Quote
Can anyone tell me how common it is for a grown man to offer a child candy?

That ruse was apparently used alot, everywhere. I've heard many people recounting experiences from childhood and being offered candy especially by men.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: wellsworth on September 01, 2012, 10:09:01 AM

That ruse was apparently used alot, everywhere. I've heard many people recounting experiences from childhood and being offered candy especially by men.

Well I mean in a benevolent way.  I remember there used to be an elderly crossing guard that gave me candy, which I accepted, but that's the only case I can think of.

Maybe the man I met just won the lottery, and felt like buying some candy to the first lucky kid he saw on the street.  ???
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: SAP on September 01, 2012, 12:08:30 PM
OK, understand now. Good decent people will give treats too and I remember getting such when I was a kid. If the man at those complexes didn't go any farther with enticing kids somewhere, he probably just was a person who really liked kids in a decent way ... perhaps someone who didn't have grandchildren or didn't have any near and his kids are all grown.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: wellsworth on January 02, 2013, 09:10:42 AM
Is this Nicole Morin? (5 years old)

(http://i.imgur.com/GAYOx.jpg)

To the left of her, is a girl named Jennifer - same friend that waited in the lobby for her?


Quote
One of the most perplexing missing persons cases in Canadian history is that of eight-year-old Nicole Morin. On Tuesday, July 30, 1985 Nicole, clad in a one-piece peach swimsuit and carrying a blanket and beach towel, left her penthouse apartment in Toronto's Etobicoke area...and vanished. She never reached the apartment's lobby where a friend named Jennifer was waiting for her. In nearly three decades there has been no trace of Nicole--who was likely abducted moments after leaving the apartment. At 10:30 a.m. Nicole had gone to the lobby of the apartment building to collect the mail. She returned to her 20th-floor apartment and got ready to go swimming with a playmate in the building's supervised outdoor pool. Before leaving the apartment, Nicole spoke to Jennifer via the building's intercom and promised to be right down. At about 11 a.m. Nicole said goodbye to her mother Jeanette, who was busy running a small daycare service she operated from her apartment. Nicole went out the door--and was never seen again. Jennifer waited about 15 minutes before buzzing the apartment again to find out why Nicole hadn't arrived at the lobby.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: wellsworth on January 02, 2013, 09:20:55 AM
OK, understand now. Good decent people will give treats too and I remember getting such when I was a kid. If the man at those complexes didn't go any farther with enticing kids somewhere, he probably just was a person who really liked kids in a decent way ... perhaps someone who didn't have grandchildren or didn't have any near and his kids are all grown.

Well that man tried to entice me to go to the convenience store with him, which was underground, in the middle of the complexes.

http://goo.gl/maps/lgbhA

To the left side was where he was standing.  Far to the right was the general area of the convenience store.

I wonder if the police have tried to do a search of all tenants that were white, male, middle aged, single, unemployed or strange working hours and lived there from at least 1982 to 1985.

I realize this is all circumstantial, but after almost 30 years, I don't think we'll ever have much to go on, aside from the killer revealing himself on his own accord.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on January 03, 2013, 09:23:16 PM
Where did that photo that you think is Nicole come from?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: forest on February 08, 2013, 08:12:07 PM
This looks like a school class picture. She sure does look like Nicole. Does anyone know for sure??
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on February 08, 2013, 10:36:42 PM
In the past, I heard of all kinds of speculation about how Nicole might have left the building. But what really bothers me is that if she was taken from the elevator (and I think there was a shoe found?) then the suspect lived in the building and it was just a case of not being able to figure out who it was. A total lockdown of the building would occur in this day and age I hope until something gave.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on February 13, 2013, 10:24:23 PM
It's possible the evil abuctor overheard Nicole talking on the intercom to her friend in the lobby about meeting to go swimming. If I have that right, she went down and got the mail then called her friend on the intercom to arrange to meet. Then she went back upstairs and perhaps got changed, delivered the mail and came back down, never to be seen again. Again, if she was under observation, the abuctor wouldn't have needed to follow her, her could have just looked to see what floor lit up on the console after she got on the elevator and took it upstairs. He then could have stationed himself on the elevator and rode it up and down until she got back on it a second time. There was a risk taken though. A risk that someone would come along and see him grabbing and/or drugging a child. That is why I think he only took her as far as out of the elevator and to a nearby apartment.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on February 14, 2013, 10:04:48 PM
Some buildings are far more sound proof than others. It would be worth knowing what was the case in this building. Even when people hear things, they usually don't do much to investigate, thinking a child is just having a tantrum, people are yelling or moving furniture around or whatever. It takes guts to intervene and knock on someone's door. I've done it myself and not even thought about the risks though it might be wiser to take precautions, call police or what not. Nicole's father is quoted as saying she simply vaporized so I guess that means without any evidence or witnesses of any sounds or sitings at all. But I think the shoe on the elevator is a strong piece of evidence as it says loudly that she did not go willingly away with someone she knew. It is more evidence than in some other cases of missing people where there is absolutely no trace left behind.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Besani on April 19, 2013, 08:29:59 AM
Where are you Nicole?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: MandM on July 20, 2013, 05:24:29 PM
Hello,

Here is the latest news report that comes after the three missing women in Cleveland were found. It has a new picture of Nicole when she was younger with her dad.

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/08/brokenhearted-dad-still-waits-for-word-about-missing-daughter (http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/08/brokenhearted-dad-still-waits-for-word-about-missing-daughter)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Besani on July 20, 2013, 06:05:52 PM
Such a nice picture
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: lostlinganer on July 20, 2013, 09:05:55 PM
just reading tonight's comments... two things come to mind:
- somebody visiting the building as a guest
- also somebody could have just put tape or a gag over the child's mouth.. then stuffed her in a suitcase or trunk large enough.

I doubt very much police investigating would bother trying to find out if anybody entered/exited the building that day carrying a large container.  just a thought!
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: MandM on July 23, 2013, 09:51:40 PM
here's something new, from Cal Millar's new book:...
She was dressed in a bathing suit and was carrying a towel. One of her shoes was found in the building's elevator."That was a horrendous case," Millar said. "My daughter was the same age; they actually shared the same birthday, and my daughter played in the re-enactment that was created for television."One of Nicole's shoes was found in the elevator? ...http://www.insidetoronto.com/print/1284440
Hello Sleuth,
In 1986, Millar was writing that no trace of her was found and police did not believe she was attacked on the elevator but made it to the lobby. http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/thestar/access/475012981.html?FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=Mar+23%2C+1986&author=Cal+Millar+Toronto+Star&pub=Toronto+Star&desc=Huge+police+search+for+Nicole+called+off+after+9+months&pqatl=google (http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/thestar/access/475012981.html?FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=Mar+23%2C+1986&author=Cal+Millar+Toronto+Star&pub=Toronto+Star&desc=Huge+police+search+for+Nicole+called+off+after+9+months&pqatl=google)
Are you sure he didn't get Nicole mixed up with Marianne Schuett, whose shoe was found? Millar's book had a couple hundred cases in it. Although you'd think he'd remember it well if his daughter was in the re-enactment....
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: MandM on August 10, 2013, 10:15:16 PM
just reading tonight's comments... two things come to mind:
- somebody visiting the building as a guest
- also somebody could have just put tape or a gag over the child's mouth.. then stuffed her in a suitcase or trunk large enough.
The problem I have with that is that the crime is so unique, a disappearance without a trace, for Toronto that you have to wonder why it happened to someone who was new to the city. Nicole had only been here a couple of years. Why did this happen to her and not to the thousands of other girls who've always been here?

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: leonagleant on May 24, 2014, 12:13:02 AM
The Toronto Police Service has partnered with Missing Kids.ca and Mac's convenience stores to raise awareness about missing kids including Nicole Morin. See media launch at this YouTube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6G1qR_Oc1o
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: insidethebox on July 03, 2014, 04:28:27 PM
Citynews sat down with the detective in this case.. seems like there is new leads and evidence she MAY be alive..

http://www.citynews.ca/2014/07/03/inside-story-extra-police-update-nicole-morins-disappearance/
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: lostlinganer on July 28, 2014, 10:34:13 PM
Does anybody know where little Nicole was born?  ... maybe North Bay? Brampton?  or was she born in Etobicoke where she disappeared from? ... somebody asked me that question just now and I have no idea if the Morins lived elsewhere.... just curious ::)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: never_lose_hope on July 30, 2014, 08:19:28 AM
From Toronto Police:

Police seek information into 1985 abduction of Nicole Morin,
Police re-enactment video released


Broadcast time: 09:45
 Wednesday, July 30, 2014

 22 Division
416-808-2200


 On Wednesday, July 30, 2014, the Toronto Police Service released a re-enactment video to raise awareness and gather new information on the 1985 abduction of Nicole Morin.

On Tuesday July 30, 1985, Nicole, 8, was abducted from her apartment building at 627 The West Mall in Etobicoke.

Nicole had made plans with a friend to meet in the lobby of her building to go swimming. At approximately 11 a.m., Nicole said goodbye to her mother and left the apartment to meet her friend. Nicole was never seen again.

What resulted was the most intensive and extensive police search for a missing person in Toronto Police Service history. Over 15,000 man-hours were put into the investigation, including the creation of a 20-member Task Force. Over 900 community members joined the search for Nicole.

To recognize the 29th anniversary of Nicole's abduction, the Toronto Police, in partnership with Toronto Crime Stoppers, have released a re-enactment video. This video can be viewed on the Toronto Police Service's YouTube channel by clicking here and can be seen in Mac's Convenience Stores across the province.

For media, the re-enactment video has been created in broadcast-quality 1920x1080 HD and hard copies will be available in both .MP4 and ProRes422HQ versions.

In addition, Twitter and Facebook accounts have been created under #FindNicole and members of the public are encouraged to visit these sites, often, for photos of Nicole and updates on the investigation.

Investigators are hoping anyone with any information about what happened on July 30, 1985 will contact police at 416-808-2200, Crime Stoppers anonymously at 416-222-TIPS (8477), online at www.222tips.com, text TOR and your message to CRIMES (274637), or Leave A Tip on Facebook.


Nicole Louise Morin, was born on April 1, 1977. At the time of her abduction, she was 4'0", 51 lbs, with brown hair and brown eyes. Nicole had a birthmark on the right side of her forehead, protruding ears and a gap between her front teeth. She had pierced ears. She was wearing a peach one-piece bathing suit with coloured stripes on the front, a green headband and red canvas shoes. She was carrying a peach-coloured blanket and a purple beach towel.


For more news, visit TPSnews.ca.

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: discus on July 30, 2014, 05:12:37 PM
I just saw the video on CTV regarding Nicole's disappearance.  I haven't read this whole post, however the police did specify they are not certain Nicole made it out of the apartment building on her way to meet her friend swimming.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: debbiec on July 31, 2014, 10:08:12 AM
Newly released re-enactment video of Nicole's disappearance can be viewed at the link below.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/07/30/nicole-morin-missing-toronto-police_n_5634635.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/07/30/nicole-morin-missing-toronto-police_n_5634635.html)


Nicole Morin Missing Person Case Revived After 29 Years

The Huffington Post Canada  | By Joanna Adams Email   Posted: 07/30/2014 3:01 pm EDT Updated: 07/30/2014 3:59 pm EDT Print Article

Have you seen this girl?

An eight-year-old girl disappeared "without a trace" 29 years ago, after she left her Toronto-area apartment to swim with a friend nearby. Nicole Morin, last seen at 11 a.m. on July 30, 1985, is thought to have been abducted from her Etobicoke, Ont. home.

Now, nearly three decades later, Toronto police are re-opening the missing person investigation.

Det. Sgt. Madelaine Tretter revealed new technologies, social media, and fresh leads prompted the revival of this case, according to the Toronto Star. Despite the fact that the 627 The West Mall complex did not have surveillance footage of Nicole's reported abduction, Toronto police, along with Crime Stoppers, have released a one-minute re-enactment video of her disappearance.

"No trace of Nicole Morin has ever been found," said Tretter, before admitting the police never lost hope prior to re-opening this case. "We do hope that, at the very minimum, that we'll find information as to what happened that day."

At a press conference Thursday morning, Tretter revealed the most recent tip in the Morin case came earlier this year.

For now, it remains unknown as to whether Morin went missing before meeting up with her friend, or if she even made it to her building's elevator. The motive behind who could have taken the eight-year-old — or if she had a familial or social connection to the abductor — also remains a mystery.

As for her family, her mother's final memory of her daughter is a passing goodbye they shared before she left for a swim.

That day, Morin's friend called her mother to let her know they did not, in fact, meet up to go swimming. Morin never made it to the pool that day.

In the re-enactment video, which was uploaded to the Toronto Police Services YouTube channel, the narrator calls the case one of the "most exhaustive and intensive investigations in Canadian history."

The National Post reports nearly 15,000 hours were spent on the investigation to find Morin. A 20-member task force was also formed, and 900 community members were actively involved in the search.

Now, using the hashtag #FindNicole, police, family and Crime Stoppers believe, in some form, the truth is out there.

“Witnesses may remember something they saw that can assist investigators," Toronto Crime Stoppers’ co-ordinator Chris Scherk told the Toronto Star. "Also, criminals talk. They brag, and they confess. My belief is someone out there may know what happened to Nicole Morin in 1985 and for whatever reason feels like they can’t come forward.”

Police are not yet treating this case as a homicide, and say there is no evidence that would suggest Morin has died.

Born on April 1, 1977, Morin would be 37 today. When she was last seen, she had brown hair, stood at four feet tall, weighed approximately 51 pounds, and had a gap in between her teeth. Police have yet to release a rendering of what Morin would look like today.

Back on July 3, CityNews aired a profile on Morin's disappearance, where Det.-Const. Kim Litster-MacLeod said, "She's out there somewhere."

"If it takes the rest of my career to keep looking for her, then that's what will happen."

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: capeheart on July 31, 2014, 04:24:46 PM
 Wondering why after all this time that they know something. Anything that can solve this case, sure would be wonderful for the mom and relatives of this child. What happened to Nicole???
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jellybean on July 31, 2014, 06:08:44 PM
I just hope that the tip given to law enforcement, that Nicole is still alive, is in fact correct.  That the information given to them is believable. 

Why get her Dad's hopes up?  I believe IN MIRACLES, but am also very cautious.

This has happened before on other cases, and it falls flat on its face.

Am I being negative?  No - just very hopeful and yet cautious.

Until she is found alive, I reserve judgement.

But it sure as heck is well worth the try!!!

JB
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: lostlinganer on July 31, 2014, 07:59:26 PM
Does anybody know where little Nicole was born?  ... maybe North Bay? Brampton?  or was she born in Etobicoke where she disappeared from? ... somebody asked me that question just now and I have no idea if the Morins lived elsewhere....
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on August 01, 2014, 03:57:27 AM
When Nicole went missing....didn't her Dad say something about his church members?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: debbiec on August 01, 2014, 01:41:29 PM
Quote
For someone to get Nicole in the elevator that would have to be certain that no one else was in the elevator or was getting in/off the elevator, otherwise the risk of someone giving a suspect description and the person being caught would be too much. Was it someone known to Nicole she trusted? A maintenance person that knew the building and how to "trick" the elevator?

It is possible to "lock" an elevator (on the control panel) with a key. Caretakers/maintenace people usually carry one, as well as master keys that will unlock any door in the building.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jobo on August 01, 2014, 02:11:36 PM
I believe I read that at the time Nicole went missing, there was a lady with a clip board in the building.  Whether or not she was interviewed and subsequently cleared, I don't recall.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: never_lose_hope on October 08, 2014, 12:19:31 PM
Police officers are searching an area northwest of Barrie, possibly connected to the case of missing Nicole Morin.
From News Talk 1010:

She was just 8 years old when she vanished from an apartment building in Etobicoke.

The case has never been solved.

In the past, friends and acquaintances have been cleared of any wrong doing in the case.

With this search, the OPP would only say they are helping with an investigation, but it's one that is being led by Toronto Police.

Toronto Police meanwhile, wouldn't say what case the investigation is connected to.
- See more at: http://www.newstalk1010.com/news/2014/10/08/police-search-near-barrie-in-connection-with-nicole-morin-case#sthash.y93eMgA8.dpuf
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: eyeswideopen on October 08, 2014, 04:37:53 PM
Here is a  better link from city tv shows the numbers of opp involved and more

http://www.citynews.ca/2014/10/08/toronto-police-opp-conduct-search-in-nicole-morins-disappearance/
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: discus on October 09, 2014, 10:18:51 AM
The search for a girl last seen 29 years ago continues for a second day in a wooded area north of Barrie, Ont. as police hope new technology can provide clues to the cold case.
Police are acting on a tip received after releasing a video re-enactment in July of Nicole Morin's disappearance.
Approximately 50 officers are searching ditches along the north side of Horseshoe Valley Road in Springwater Township. They're focusing on the area between Gill Road and Old Second Road, and are planning to wrap up the search Thursday afternoon.
RELATED STORIES
Police search for leads in Nicole Morin cold case
Cold case: Police release video re-enactment of Nicole Morin disappearance
PHOTOS
 
Police are searching a wooded area of Springwater Township, Ont. on Thursday, Oct. 9, 2014.
 
Police vehicles line Horseshoe Valley Road in Springwater Township, Ont. on Thursday, Oct. 9, 2014.
 
Nicole Morin, 8, went missing on July 30, 1985.
On Wednesday, police and cadaver dogs combed the ditches along Old Second Road, but didn't find anything.
Police searched the same area when Morin disappeared, but are hoping that new technology may unearth more clues.
Morin was 8 when she disappeared from her west-end Toronto apartment building the morning of July 30, 1985. She left her penthouse apartment at 627 The West Mall in Etobicoke, and headed to the ground floor to meet a friend to go swimming.
Police are unsure whether she made it to the lobby. At the time, she was wearing a coral bathing suit, and was described as 4-foot-2 with brown hair and brown eyes. Her ears were pierced and she had a small birthmark on the upper right side of her forehead. She weighed approximately 60 pounds.
If Morin is still alive, she's now 37 years old.
Anyone with details is asked to call Toronto police at 416-808-2200, or contact Crime Stoppers anonymously at 1-800-222-8477 (TIPS).
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/police-hoping-new-technology-will-unearth-old-clues-in-ontario-cold-case-1.2046882
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: discus on October 09, 2014, 03:05:33 PM
I also wonder what would compel them to come forward now.  The video must have triggered something.  With such a long passage of time, and a rural area, it may be a difficult search, with the wildlife in the area displacement could be possible.  I would like to know to what degree can the dogs sense if there was a person there?
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: debbiec on October 09, 2014, 03:57:45 PM
Nicole Morin-related search ends in Springwater Township

Police find 'nothing conclusive' in case of missing girl after two-day search of wooded area

CBC News Posted: Oct 09, 2014 12:20 PM ET| Last Updated: Oct 09, 2014 5:14 PM ET

Two days of searching a wooded area north of Barrie, Ont., have failed to yield anything conclusive about the fate of Nicole Morin, the eight-year-old girl who went missing in Toronto nearly three decades ago.

■Nicole Morin case from 1985 spawns new search north of Toronto

■Nicole Morin abduction: Police seek new clues in 1985 case

Dozens of police officers began searching on Wednesday in Springwater Township, near Old Second Road and Horseshoe Valley Drive, in relation to a tip about Nicole's long-unsolved disappearance.


Late Thursday afternoon, Toronto police Insp. Gerry Cashman said police were not any closer to finding out what happened to her.

Saying that police had found "nothing conclusive," Cashman said the nearly 30-year investigation continues, but the search in Springwater Township is over.

"Sadly, the investigation goes on. We're still searching for Nicole Morin," he said.

Police made a renewed appeal for information in Nicole's disappearance this past summer.


That led to a tip that prompted the current search. Ontario Provincial Police were assisting Toronto police at the scene over the past two days.

Nicole vanished on July 30, 1985. She walked out the door of her family's Toronto apartment to meet a friend to go swimming and never returned.

Despite an intensive investigation, police have not conclusively determined what happened to her. But they believe she was abducted.

With a report from the CBC's Sue Sgambati


http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/nicole-morin-related-search-ends-in-springwater-township-1.2793782 (http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/nicole-morin-related-search-ends-in-springwater-township-1.2793782)
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Fraser on October 09, 2014, 04:01:01 PM
Trained search dogs can find evidence decades later. It's pretty amazing.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Logical on October 09, 2014, 05:49:26 PM
I wonder if this area was damaged at all from the F4 tornado the month before, Barrie and surrounding area were started the clean up.  That would have brought many people in to the area to assist I might guess.

Would this area then have provided an even better hiding place, the ground in the area was torn to shreds thirty days before?

Wonder if any of the previous suspects or residents of her building, assisted in the tornado clean up? This would give reason for the person to be in the area. You would think the area would have been a busy area at this time.  People were in shock and may have been more aware of things happening around them or the opposite aware of nothing.

The news I heard on the tip was it was a family that witnessed, not one individual but a family and that if they still felt that strongly of what they believe they saw and with new technology that it merited another check.

Logical
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Fraser on October 10, 2014, 07:45:04 AM
Yes, they can detect the gases in the soil. Some of them can detect the bones.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: jellybean on October 10, 2014, 10:12:18 AM
Very disappointing, but not unusual./jb

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2014/10/09/police_search_yields_no_clues_in_nicole_morin_disappearance_case.html

Police search yields no clues in Nicole Morin disappearance case

Police say they've come up empty-handed after a two-day search of a wooded area near Barrie in a search for clues to the disappearance of 8-year-old Nicole Morin.

(My heart goes out to her father. Hopefully someone will through their own decency will step forward and tell the truth.)

Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: zj on July 31, 2015, 10:16:32 AM
I have been very interested in this case ever since I saw a missing person flyer posted in Toronto's Union Station a number of months ago. Yesterday marked the 30th anniversary of her disappearance, so I decided to take my bike down to her apartment building (since it's only about a half an hour ride away from my house).

It was a very eerie feeling...Knowing of the situation with Nicole, it was like a dark cloud was hanging over the entire area. It seemed to me (as someone eluded to earlier) that the area was, at one point, where rather wealthy folk resided, but has now just become your average middle class apartment building. The building is quite large, due to the fact that it is technically two in one...627 (where Nicole lived) and 625 (maybe where the friend lived?). Both have two separate entrances, but are joined together.

I considered for a moment going inside the building, and maybe even going up to the penthouse floor, but I concluded that it would be far too depressing. Looking into the lobby and behind the building evoked strange enough feelings. Quite frankly, I'm not sure how people live on that floor, assuming that they are aware of the history behind it all. I imagine (since it was July) that Nicole and her friend were planning on going to the outdoor pool (behind the building), but there is also a small indoor pool just beside the building. Between the two pools is a small parking lot and a little grassy area (with old picnic benches and playgrounds which seemed to be fenced off).

I had always assumed that Nicole was simply grabbed before she made it to the elevator by some pervert who had been eyeing her for some time (with her body eventually just being disposed of in a way that wouldn't leave a shred of evidence). The information apparently given by that women about her actually making it into the elevator and getting off at the lobby (as the reenactment video suggests) seems very hard to believe, considering the fact that her friend was standing in the lobby for quite some time. What could Nicole have possibly been doing in that time if she had indeed ended up in the lobby?

Theories about churches and other possible big schemes seem a tad far-fetched to me. I also find it difficult to believe that she's still alive, because if she was somehow in another country, under a different name, one would assume that she would have memories of her childhood and what had happened, and would eventually find her way home (or be found by someone else). We can only hope and pray that those supposed photos from the child-pornography ring are not of her (to me they don't look like her)...As awful as it is to say, it might be better if she was killed soon after her abduction (assuming she is dead), so that she was not forced to suffer for a long period of time.

One day we might find out what happened, or come across something that points to a certain conclusion, but after 30 years of virtually no evidence, it seems unlikely that anything will ever be made out of this. Her father is clearly a very strong man...That beautiful photo of him with Nicole brings me to tears. I'm not a very religious person, but maybe our only hope lies in the possibility of an afterlife, where he will be able to hold her in his arms once again. God bless Nicole, her family, and all of you who are doing their best to try to uncover the events of July 30th, 1985.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: Red Viewfinder on April 06, 2017, 07:08:59 PM
I suspect that the police know exactly who did this and do not have enough evidence for an arrest. This is exactly what happened with the Tania Murrell case in Alberta. This information is never shared with the public, so the rumours and the gossip go on and on.
It is almost certain that she was taken by someone in the building, her mother even alluded to that. What a shame this guy can't be prosecuted to give little Nicole some justice.
A child that young never should have been traversing that apartment alone, but her mom was overwhelmed with her responsibilities. It never should have happened and it is exactly why children do not play unattended anymore.
Title: Re: Nicole Morin: Missing (Toronto, 1985)
Post by: zj on May 05, 2017, 05:31:46 PM
I've been thinking about this case a little more in the past few days...I can't help but wonder why her friend didn't think of buzzing up again or taking the elevator up to her floor after she hadn't arrived to the lobby. I know she was just a kid, but it seems like that would be the thing that anyone would do in that situation, rather than just leaving after Nicole didn't show up. And had she done this, Nicole's mother (and the police) could have been informed a lot sooner. Such a sad situation.